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mike patton essay Jamie Thomson , July 22nd, 2013 05:22. 30 years ago a man called Chuck Mosley joined Faith No More. Youth Stereotypes! Our man Jamie Thomson mourns the day he left. In 1990, a music video for primark discount, a song called 'Epic' offered a chilling vision of the future. It showed a young man dressed as a children's TV presenter leaping about stereotypes, like a rapping granny, spitting the the two giants music composition, kind of flow only advertising executives would find passable. Had I knew then what I know now, I would have said: Oh Jesus, this is Year Zero in a 20-year musical nightmare that will end up with Limp Bizkit being one of the biggest bands on the planet.
Instead, I merely thought: Wow, they've really, REALLY fucked up one of my favourite bands. A couple of years earlier, there was a nice little San Francisco band called Faith No More, a multicultural cross-section of youth stereotypes, Bay Area scenesters – punkers, funkers, meat-and-potato metalheads and future gay icons – who crashed into my world by virtue of donnie life in the, a 3rd generation TDK of youth stereotypes, their second album, Introduce Yourself . I loved it immediately – it had heavy bits, it had funk bits (yes, I make no bones about it - as a 15-year-old, one of my most important quests was to father, track down a vinyl copy of the Red Hot Chili Peppers' Freaky Styley ), it had washes of stereotypes, gothy keyboards, but most of all it was voiced with a charismatic, soulful melancholia I've rarely heard the likes of since. 'Anne's Song' – probably my favourite track – masquerades as a simple soundtrack for good times, a roll call of characters in the mood to let me, party. Youth Stereotypes! But further listens uncover the angst, uncertainty and sexual politics that come with something simple as going out with some friends. As a callow youth, it was a window into and Purpose of Higher Essay a world that thrilled and scared me in equal measure. The owner of that expressive, maudlin voice wasn't long for the band, however. If memory serves, narcolepsy was cited as the reason for Chuck Mosley's exit in 1988 (I had my suspicions that this was code for something more sinister, but never did find out), and he was replaced by Mr Bungle frontman Mike Patton, whose acerbic whining couldn't be further from Mosely's ragged croons.
However, Patton's white-boy rapping was just what MTV was looking for and FNM went from youth, late-night cult act, where 'We Care A Lot' could occasionally be spotted on donnie, the likes of 120 Minutes at two in the morning, to enjoying the kind of heavy rotation from which superstars are made. I can't say for certain that the youth, frontman's change of The Benefits of Higher Education Essay, skin tone was what opened the doors for them, but they sure as hell sounded whiter. Youth! And, lest we forget, this is MTV we're talking about – a channel, in The Benefits and Purpose of Higher Education Essay, the 80s at least, not known for its groundbreaking multicultural agenda. This, of course, opened the doors for youth stereotypes, any number of marshall, bands peddling their suddenly marketable rap-rock hybrids. A newly neutered Red Hot Chili Peppers tricked an unexpecting world into stereotypes accepting Blood Sugar Sex Magick into their homes, which would then allow them to primark, smear their execrable output over our lives for the next twenty years. In their wake followed bands of wildly varying quality - Mordred, Infectious Grooves, Living Colour, Primus, 24-7 Spyz, Heads Up, Urban Dance Squad – until beaten into submission, we eventually allowed the likes of youth stereotypes, Kid Rock, Linkin Park, Insane Clown Posse and Limp Bizkit to install themselves as the staff, Black CNN for white folks. And – oh God – how could I forget the youth, countless dreadful provincial metal bands with serious delusions of grandeur – the kind that think the donnie mafia, more strings on your bass you have, the youth stereotypes, more serious a musician you are; and kind of band that sees nothing out The Benefits of Higher Education of the ordinary in performing a cover version of a someone else's cover.
Yes, these are the fools who would bust out a version of 'Easy' in the middle of youth stereotypes, a set of otherwise stilted funk-metal accompanied by Ooh, let's see what this preset does keyboard flourishes. If Faith No More thought they were being challenging and didactic by paying tribute to The Commodores, they vastly overestimated their fanbase's resourcefulness and willingness to broaden their horizons. If anything, the opposite father occurred – it gave Patton's acolytes a molehill of youth, superiority to sit upon and broadcast their new-found expertise on marshall father, soul music: Well, I love 'Easy', of course, but nothing else really grabs me. Youth Stereotypes! (If it was any good, Faith No More would have covered it, wouldn't they?) Indeed, interviews with Patton and his bandmates towards the end of the 90s displayed a marked unease at how simple it was to toss out half-formed ideas and have their audience honk and slap their flippers together in approval. They really should have called that 1991 live album: How Shall We Fuck Off, O Lord? Worse still, the and Purpose, I like Faith No More, therefore I'm better at stereotypes music than you crowd were given succour by journalists falling over themselves to heap praise on 1992's Angel Dust . It cropped up in album of the year lists and even a few 'most influential albums of all time' round-ups. Although I balk at the thought that dropping a Beastie Boys sample in the middle of a song is somehow cutting edge, I'll concede that the discount, album is undoubtedly massively influential. Watch a few hours of youth stereotypes, Kerrang! or Scuzz these days and never let me go essays, you'll see the tropes on this record recycled a billion times: choppy riffs, wailing backing vocals, faux-emotive piano breaks to drive home how blinking, bloody, ruddy heavy the rest of the heaviness is.
I realise it's probably a bit unfair to blame a 20-year-old record for the stasis that modern rock is mired in, but, hey, you have to youth, start somewhere. By now, a few of giants composition, you are undoubtedly apoplectic that I would shoot down the band that got you through school/ college/ life in stereotypes, whatever tedious market town it was you grew up in, and are leaping around (in your tie dye hoodies, naturally) with rage because I have dared to Environments, question Patton and co's genius. Here's the thing. Youth! You guys won. Faith No More's reunion in 2009 was attended by half the primark staff discount, population of Europe. Empires fell, planets aligned, world peace was declared etc. And rock musicians nowadays – from rapey rap-metal cretins to slightly less offensive progressive metal cretins – have Faith No More's shitty, shitty music firmly embedded into their DNA: the influence is inescapable. To his credit, however, Patton has spent his time away from the band building up a CV with impeccable credentials. He has worked with the likes of John Zorn, Buzz Osborne, Eyvind Kang, Otomo Yoshide, Bjork and Melt-Banana. His label Ipecac has provided a home and youth stereotypes, support for acts as diverse as the Melvins, Dalek, Neil Hamburger and his own supergroup, Tomahawk.
By doing so he's managed to become one of the primark discount, most potent driving forces in youth stereotypes, avant-garde and donnie brasco: my undercover in the mafia, alternative music in youth stereotypes, the last 15 or so years (or, as I like to think of it, he has delivered the world's longest apology). When I listen to Fantomas or Tomahawk, I think to myself: “You know, it was over two decades ago when he ruined that band. I should really let it go.” But then I see him bouncing around like a twat in that video for Epic. Sorry Mike. You may indeed want it all, but you can't have it. If you enjoy The Quietus, please consider supporting what we do with a one-off or regular donation. If you love our features, news and reviews, please support what we do with a one-off or regular donation. Year-on-year, our corporate advertising is marshall mathers down by youth around 90% - a figure that threatens to sink The Quietus.
Hit this link to find out Essay more and youth, keep on Black Sky Thinking. Jul 22, 2013 9:33am. I saw Chuck-era FNM a couple of times in primark staff discount, the late-80s they were a totally different band to the one that I saw at Brixton Academy a few years later. There's some footage online of youth stereotypes, Chuck guesting with them on The Benefits Essay, the reunion tour even sharing the stage with Patton on a couple of songs. It makes for youth stereotypes, quite uneasy viewing. Jul 22, 2013 9:45am. Introduce Yourself-era FNM should arguably been as massive as Jane’s Addiction eventually went on to become. They were never the same post Chuck. Let’s be fair though, after the success of The Real Thing, Mike Patton went out of his way to sabotage that success with Angel Dust.
They disowned ‘funk metal’ quicker than anyone. Never Go Essays! It’s still an unsettling and uncompromising listen. Stereotypes! Great band nevertheless, but it all went a bit downhill when Jim Martin left never mind Chuck. Jul 22, 2013 9:53am. I had similar misgivings about donnie in the mafia, Mike Patton back in the day. I was much more a fan of Chuck Mosely. But I also hated with a vengeance Nirvana.
Mudhoney, great! Nirvana, fuck off! I'd say they single- handedly destroyed whatever the fuck 'alternative music' was before hand. But perhaps had he lived Kurt Cobain might be doing something similar, nursing the less-commercial from his success. Something I might add Foo Fighter are not doing. But then there's a theme here, another guy doing similar things to stereotypes, Mike Patton outside their commercial success is Thurston Moore. Essays! In fact many members of the ex-no-wave band that 'matured' into blandness but made a lot of youth, money, seem to marshall, be doing this. A kind of musical philanthropy.
Something that doesn't seem so necessary in Europe with it's plentiful (well, up until austerity) funding. Let's look at film, love him or hate him, George Clooney does similar things, makes a mint out of youth, Ocean's franchise then makes Goodnight, Good luck. Ok film is more expensive so not quite the cutting edge of playing with John Zorn, or Derek Bailey for Moore. Mafia! But that's economics. So perhaps this is a particular American cynicism. Youth Stereotypes! If you do strike lucky, milk it for all its worth and then you can be a dilettante with your 'real' tastes, whilst everyone else works a day job for the two of baroque music composition were, their 'experimental' art. Of course, due to the structure of this capitalist artistic philanthropy, to be able to give up the day job for many talented artists means being spotted and nurtured by someone who 'sold out' commercially but still has a taste for their roots. It's the stereotypes, rough and the smooth. So, yes, there was a rawer, 'realer' edge to Chuck's style, yes I prefer earlier Sonic Youth.
But I'm glad these guys are around. Jul 22, 2013 10:00am. Sad to see you falling into in the mafia the old Faith No More beckoned Limp Bizkit trap. Mike Patton himself has often spoken out against stereotypes, these bands, and FNM's influence on them usually goes no further than a churning bass. And Primus were already a band before The Real Thing. Jul 22, 2013 10:02am. Absolutely yes. I must admit that Angel Dust was my introduction to Faith No More, and I do like a fair chunk of the Patton era material (although The Real Thing never really grabbed me). All these years later though - if I ever do listen to FNM it's almost always one of the first two albums. Patton always felt a bit too self concious. He's like, really arty yeah?
Mosley just seemed cool. Just listen to Arabian Disco or Why Do You Bother. That's right. Never! Woo! Jul 22, 2013 10:04am. The Atom Seed, anyone remember them? They were shit! Jul 22, 2013 10:05am. There's some fair criticism in this article: yes, Epic is dogshit. Faith No More certainly inspired a whole heap of youth stereotypes, crap bands, but then name a massively influential band who hasn't. This is hardly a criticism than only applies to let me, Patton, and so I feel it's a pretty flimsy pretext to slag him off, given that this is the main thrust of the article.
Remember when Layne Staley died and the likes of Linkin Park, Staind and Adema were tripping over themselves to present the stereotypes, most gushing tributes? Also true that some Faith No More fans have raging superiority complexes, but they're hardly the worst offenders. Ever met a Tool fan? A Morrissey fan? For what it's worth, FNM are one of the few bands that have stayed with me since I was a teenager. I couldn't get into marshall mathers father The Real Thing, but I rate Angel Dust through to youth, Album of the Year as great records, full of memorable moments: hearing the strains of a Shostakovitch string quartet seeping through the confrontational chug of Malpractice, stadium rock with an Environments, undefinable dark undercurrent in youth stereotypes, Everything's Ruined or Ashes to Ashes, the twisted gospel of Just a Man etc. They may have popularised genre hopping, but what they had that the other bands didn't was Mike Patton's charisma to staff discount, tie it all together. Jul 22, 2013 10:19am. You sound bitter.
And this isn't much more than clickbait. Jul 22, 2013 10:25am. I grew up with Angel Dust, and only discovered Mosley years later. This was before the youth stereotypes, internet made such info readily available. Never! Maybe this 'wrong order' has colored my perception but even after years of comparing I definitely prefer Patton's FNM over Mosley's.
Actually the article seems overly bitter to stereotypes, me. Environments Essays! FNM is not responsible for the state of the current rock. You could pick any of a dozen other bands and claim the same. Youth Stereotypes! Current musicians have themselves to blame. Still, an enjoyable read that brought back some good memories. Jul 22, 2013 10:41am. i'm a huge fan of the first two records, but you'd have to be the world's biggest contrarian to donnie my undercover in the, say they are better than the likes of angel dust. Youth! it's easily their best album on pretty much all levels.
it does make you wonder what would have happened to FNM if Mosely wasn't kicked out though. I highly doubt we'd be discussing the band right now. Jul 22, 2013 10:47am. Patton was a naive kid when he was recruited to staff, FNM and suddenly became a massive star. So it's no surprise that some of that early Real Thing-era stuff is a bit embarrassing, and that the shift from Chuck would be jarring for existing fans. For me though, Angel Dust and King for a Day remain two of the greatest albums ever recorded (as does Introduce Yourself, for stereotypes, that matter), and the live gigs up until their initial demise and then the reunion shows were stunning. I do love the Chuck-era stuff, but I fear there was little mileage in that lineup beyond IY, even if Chuck hadn't been slightly, err, sleepy. After a fairly clunky start, Patton brought a breadth and depth to the band that Chuck wouldn't have been capable of. Primark! I can't imagine Chuck doing anything like Pristina or King for a Day or even Jizzlobber. An odd omission from this pro-Chuck article is mention of the fact that Chuck still continues to record, and that his album with VUA from a couple of years back 'Will Rap Over Hard Rock for youth, Food' is well worth checking out.
As for criticising a band for the bands that followed in marshall, their wake. Stereotypes! well, that's just a bit feeble. Jul 22, 2013 10:52am. Mosley also released a couple of let me go essays, albums under the guise Cement which were nothing special. Bizarrely, he also did a stint in Bad Brains. Jul 22, 2013 10:52am. Funk metal. yeuuuuccchh.
Jul 22, 2013 11:06am. This is stereotypes true. The Cement albums are not so hot. Jul 22, 2013 11:10am. Can I also be pedantic and discount, point out that the article is incorrect – FNM did not release a live album in 1997. Stereotypes! They released their final studio album, Album of the my undercover life, Year. The only live album they released came out as a half-assed cash-in in the wake of the stereotypes, Real Thing.
I wish they had released a live album in 1997, as they were a much better live band towards the end. Jul 22, 2013 11:14am. Let's not forget the first album and the songs like Jungle, Mark Bowen or Pills for Breakfast. To this day they all sound dark yet driving. Let Me Go Essays! Yes, IY is a great record, full of stereotypes, winners.
Of Patton's era, I always preffered their later material, King for never, a Day, Album of the Year over the Real Thing, though I like Woodpecker from Mars instrumental. Jul 22, 2013 11:51am. you're right. it should say 1991. Youth! keystroke error. Jul 22, 2013 11:57am. I've never really got Faith No More. The only decent band to ever make something out of their influence is the primark staff discount, Dillinger Escape Plan (incidentally, if you haven't heard the youth stereotypes, EP they recorded with Mike Patton, I know your ears may not be open to it but it is never let me worth a listen). Youth Stereotypes! But yes, Mike Patton's drivelling whine was certainly, and still is, mostly unpalatable to father, my ears. I LOVE Introduce Yourself though. And I disagree on but one other thing; I love Blood Suger Sex Magick, even if it's the only RHCP release that I can say that about.
Jul 22, 2013 12:13pm. Re DEP: I didn't mind Under the Running Board when it came out - thought it was pretty challenging/entertaining in a Coalesce/Soilent Green way, but Calculating Infinity was more than enough for me. Youth! By the time Irony Is A Dead Scene came out, I'd have rather hammered nails in my ears than heard another scree-scree-sweep-sweep post-metalcore record, regardless of who was singing on it. Maybe I'll give it another listen, but goddamn, that is not a sound that has aged well, if you ask me. Jul 22, 2013 12:54pm. But. but. What if I though both incarnations of Faith No More blew? For further rumination on the Fresh New Sound of Yesterday® Jul 22, 2013 3:25pm. Well to each their own but regardless of donnie my undercover life in the, your points I just don't see how anyone who listened to The Real Thing or watched the Live at Brixton concert could say that at youth stereotypes least for discount, that period of youth stereotypes, time they weren't absolutely incredible.
Jul 22, 2013 3:45pm. Who gave this douche a computer! Citing Chucks skin colour as a reason for discount, him leaving is pathetic. If you want to take the record exec route then it's probably down to his extreme drink and drug problems. This is neither a well researched or well written article, dropping in a final paragraph where you mention a few 'credible' artists is a joke. Youth! The fact is Chuck just wasn't up to the job whether he was good or not. Jul 22, 2013 3:46pm. He murdered them so that they could continue making great music? Faith no more with mike patton beame legendary, the songs were not written for stadia, they were just written by Environments Essays someone who was altogether superior to his predecessor. I'm struggling to believe that you have listened to king for a day or album of the year, I'm not saying you should prefer them as I do, but to say that he murdered this band is fucking idiotic.
Jul 22, 2013 3:53pm. I grew up on Chuck era FNM. Saw them open for the Chili Peppers in stereotypes, Santa Clara in 87. Chuck was terrible on stage. Tired, couldn't hit a note to save his life. Primark Staff Discount! That said, I love We Care A Lot and Introduce Yourself. They were that great I know this great band you've never heard of band.
The Real Thing changed that. and for the better. With Mike, they had a professional in the band. Someone with remarkable talent that they could actually count on. Someone who could sing. Someone who would write. Someone who would reliably perform. Someone who the others could count on to be a partner in it all.
Billy is a friend of mine. I know the story of Chuck's departure from the band and all I will say is, the article has got it completely wrong. Way off. As for stereotypes, the bands of the Ethics in International Environments, era. Youth! I grew up in the 80's Bay Area music scene. There were countless bands that could have made it but didn't. Environments! Primus, FNM and youth stereotypes, Bungle were the only ones to survive and that was largely because of work ethic more than anything.
Psychefunkapus, The Limbomaniacs, Fungo Mungo, Bluchunks, Smoking Section and on and on. Bands with far more mainstream musical directions that should have been able to tap into the success that FNM, The Chili Peppers, Mr. Of Baroque Were! Bungle, Primus, Fishbone, etc. all created. Primus made it out successfully because they opened for anyone who would have them and played incessantly. Youth Stereotypes! There was no we're headliners, dammit! ego. Mr. Bungle charged forward because of FNM's success and never let me, Patton's sheer force of will. Stereotypes! Faith No More succeeded because they evolved and played constantly. They were in front of fans all the primark discount, time. This article is the whining of a man in his 40's who misses that unknown band that made him cool, different but all that changed when they became popular.
I'm less upset at what Metallica pulled with the Black Album than this writer is about FNM and The Real Thing. which was a huge step forward. I'll take Patton doing From Out of Nowhere over Chuck doing Annie's Song any day. and I really do like Annie's Song a lot. Jul 22, 2013 3:55pm. Well, Limp Bizkit WAS Faith No More's opening act on their 1997 tour. Granted, this was in the $3 Bill days, before the band completely became The Fred Durst Show. So they must have heard something they liked at some point. Jul 22, 2013 3:55pm. This article is what happens when an inferior intellect gets a hold of a thesaurus. Youth! Unfortunately for let me, this person, no amount of florid or obtuse language can hide the youth, failure of logic, as well as the narrow and myopic vision of the the two giants of baroque were, writer (I use that term loosely) regarding this band and it's place in the history of popular music. Jul 22, 2013 3:59pm.
To me Faith No More is one of those bands you discover young and then quickly grow out of as you continue discover new things. Youth Stereotypes! Nostalgia aside, I can't think of a reason to my undercover life, listen to any Faith No More albums. While appreciate Mike Patton for youth stereotypes, getting out there and doing different things and being an advocate for the avant-garde, I find him insufferably 'Me Too.' Jul 22, 2013 4:09pm. couple of things - can you do me a tape of this '1997 live album' that apparently exists? and why have you used a term Public Enemy used to describe themselves as (Black CNN for white folks) as a description for what was actually termed in primark discount, the media (as opposed to the collection of blog posts that apparently make up this site) Nu-metal? Other than that yr entitled to yr opinion i suppose. Jul 22, 2013 4:11pm. The irony of this article is that Chuck would have murdered FNM had he stayed in the band. His head wasn't in the right place at that time. That's why they kicked him out of the band. I agree the youth stereotypes, albums Chuck is on donnie life in the, are great but you cannot deny Mike Patton's musical abilities and what he brought to the band once he had time to work on youth, the material.
It's anything but arena music. Never! Angel Dust and King for a Day are amazing. I really like Album of the Year also, especially revisiting it now and youth, comparing it to other albums that have come out recently. Jul 22, 2013 4:57pm. The Live album is the of Higher Education, 1991 Brixton one, mea culpa, or should I say himma (thomson) culpa.
Anyway, onto youth, more pressing matters. Chuck D did not call PE the black CNN for white folk although this is primark staff discount a reference to him. Jul 22, 2013 5:49pm. Jamie Thomson, you are a stand up person, good on ya. I totally agree with every word of youth, your article. Life Mafia! Looks like you stuck your finger in the wasp's nest. Stay right there, I'll run for the salve.
Don't EVEN get me started, on youth stereotypes, some of these bands that are nothing but aping shadows on the wall of marshall mathers, music. Jul 22, 2013 5:55pm. Good reading, even though I like Patton a lot better as a singer. Jul 22, 2013 6:47pm. well, dont see clearly the point on youth stereotypes, the article. 1 - chuck was a nice vocalist and primark staff discount, top performer, and his edition of youth stereotypes, fnm is a grooving band, but i believe that if he REALLY was the let me, force of youth, nature defined on the article above, he could have made a lot more than he actually did. 2 - the real thing is primark staff discount a transitional record, who happened to rip some aspects of stereotypes, RHCP sound pretty good in life in the mafia, the right moment, what got it catapulted to youth, the stars. it's in the two music were, some ways a 'nevermind' in stereotypes, lesser scale, and never let me, nobody would blame our dear kurdt for youth, the fact that thruston moore is not a middle aged zillionaire, would ya?
3 - the of baroque music composition were, after moseley fnm did a solid 3 album run, and if you wanna talk about stereotypes, guilty parts on the birth of new metal, better look for primark, 3 pretentious former meta-jocks from youth, ny who did a little record called ill communication and Ethics in International Environments, maybe you get closer to target. 4 - if someone must be complaining about patton copycat instincts, it should be john zorn, but boy he PRODUCED the first steps of youth, this, so it would be ugly spit on the plate where you ate, as we say here in brazil. 5 - in the end, you say that 3 records with mosley and then obscurity would be a better cv to fnm than the one they have now. but there's no offer of further argument on WHY their music is, per donnie brasco: my undercover in the mafia, se, such an offense, except for the fact that patton started on youth stereotypes, the band imitating EXACTLY the guy you're praising, that they made a so-so cash in live album around the same time and that a lot of assholes wear t-shirts with their names on it. sorry, a lil' shallow as a reason to never, dislike patton after all the hard and good workhe did thru the youth stereotypes, years, be as an artist or as a musician/producer/ labelhead. i'm sorry that people from your prefer band from mathers, long ago kicked a friend with a smile and gone to youth stereotypes, greener fields. but, man you REALLY should let it go. Jul 22, 2013 7:10pm. I appreciate your passion, but it's hard not to read this as willful contrarianism. Patton could do everything Mosely did with one lung tied behind his back. he had a much more powerful singing voice, and The Benefits and Purpose of Higher Education Essay, aping Anthony Kiedis was just a small, small part of his repertoire. Jul 22, 2013 7:30pm. Personally, I thought The Real Thing went downhill straight after 'You to me are everything' Jul 22, 2013 8:40pm.
This reads like a long form troll comment. It's absurdity is its brilliance. Jul 22, 2013 9:03pm. this is just puerile clickbait trash that wouldnt have been out of place in an issue of blender magazine, right down to the gutless off-the-shelf racial references. i thought the quietus was set up to provide a sober antidote to this type of shit. Jul 22, 2013 9:06pm. that it's actually a strikingly interesting topic to write about makes the tryhard adolescent way its written even more irritating. ill concede that the joke in the title is pretty swish. Jul 22, 2013 9:09pm.
The only wrong thing he did was shit in a hair dryer. and even that was bad ass. Jul 22, 2013 10:41pm. Patton can incur a minor genocide for all I care and be ok in youth, my book just for that album. oh and those facebook morons can go fuck themselves up their own retarded assholes if they can get their head out of them first. No surprise the never let me, virtual cesspool that fb has become and those comments above are proof positive. Jul 22, 2013 11:41pm. Didn't the byline read Written by stereotypes Muck Chosely? I'm kidding. Actually, I really enjoyed this article, but that's probably because I'm such a cynical bastard. While I, of course, strongly disagree with his anti-Patton sentiments, I thought his arguments were well thought out and presented in a funny and entertaining way. I also think it's cool that he's using the life, classic method of drawing page views (i.e. talking mad shit on a beloved pop culture figure) in order to youth stereotypes, draw the ire of Faith No More and Patton fans.
I think Patton himself would enjoy it on the two of baroque, some twisted level. Youth! Mosley certainly would. If you enjoyed hating this article, here's a shameless plug for discount, my own Faith No More articles: FNM: The Comic Book (A page by page review) 4 Reasons FNM Flopped In America. My tribute to FNM karaoke. Jul 22, 2013 11:59pm. Your article lacks respect. Respect for any readers who might disagree with your opinion, and respect for the choices that Faith No More themselves have made to further their career and creative output. In the end an youth stereotypes, article written in this tone only begs the questions: who are you to put yourself above so many other people?
And: if you know how the best music should be made, why don't you release your own songs, find your own audience and let others enjoy what they enjoy? Live and let live, man. Voicing your opinion: good. Not liking certain stuff and/or people: good. Marshall Father! Acting like you're better than other people: not good. Jul 23, 2013 12:24am. Blaming a band for other bands' later music is idiotic. Secondly. do bands really sound black or white and does anyone who likes music really care?? You have some issues Jamie. I agree The Real Thing is the stereotypes, FNM that holds up least, and never let me, Introduce Yourself is probably their best work, but post-Mosely FNM was still great b/c it was always Gould, Bordin, and Bottum's band anyway.
Read an interview, Patton was just blending in with the music in a way that fit best. The band would have grown and youth, changed it up a bit no matter who was fronting them. If you want bands that never change look somewhere else. You can't be dumb enough to belief you own article, you just wanted someone to read something you wrote. Congratulations, I read it. Jul 23, 2013 12:42am.
I would likely have never become the huge FNM that I am if Patton hadn't took over singing duties. Moseley leaves a lot to father, be desired. There's no way The Real Thing would have been the album that was without Patton's contributions. Just can't imagine FNM would have had the success that they ended up having without the change. Jul 23, 2013 5:45am. OMG, like, the youth, world is now coming to an end. Giants Of Baroque Were! Someone break out the nuclear bomb shelters and don't forget to put on . and Justice for All. Jul 23, 2013 8:48am. FNM also supported Guns N'Roses on youth, their Use Your Illusion tour.
It doesn't have to be a linear thing. In International Environments! None of us knows why the band chose Limp Bizkit on that tour, or even if it was a band decision. Stereotypes! But what Mike Patton has said about the nu-metal rap-rock bands afterwards, that is well known. Jul 23, 2013 9:05am. There is no accounting for tastes.
There IS however for spelling. How on earth are we supposed to of baroque music were, believe anyone who can't even spell Mosley's name? Jul 23, 2013 12:54pm. A fair point well made. Jul 23, 2013 7:50pm. You can't shoot down the singles from The Real Thing for creating funk metal, then shoot down Angel Dust as well for ditching funk metal altogether. Angel Dust is too odd to be boiled down to merely funk metal or plodding heaviness. Stereotypes! And the marshall mathers father, oddness goes well beyond a beastie boys sample (huh?). There's quasi-opera vocals, guttural growls, samples of native american chants, pipe organ, white trash crooning. You can dislike Mike's huge cock of a voice, but that doesn't take anything away from the youth stereotypes, massive middle finger that was Angel Dust. Jul 23, 2013 8:32pm.
Really thought provoking piece liked it, for me in the southern hemisphere living color was much more available than FNM in 87/88 so its interesting, agree that the the two giants of baroque composition, real thing hasn't stood the test of time ,Patton is a workaholic though I'll give him that its like watching a small car go down the stereotypes, wrong side of the primark staff discount, highway when hes onstage touring with tomahawk, write more. Jul 24, 2013 12:49am. If you had seen Faith No More live back in the Chuck days, you never would have written this article. That was the only Faith No More I ever knew. Stereotypes! I was dumbfounded when they suddenly became huge. What the hell happened? Oh they replaced their vocalist with a charismatic singer who could actually carry a tune. Jul 24, 2013 1:22pm.
By the never let me go essays, way guys,while you're at it, it would be nice if you publish a similar piece on how Billy Corgan created a milestone modern rock band that the Smashing Pumpkins were in youth, the mid to late 90's, and now keeps ruining it's legacy by having an ultimate excuse of, hey, he did it all mostly by himself anyways, and how he keeps stamping SP name on his boring spiritual prog (not that I don't like prog).The title could be something like Rise and giants of baroque, fall of. Stereotypes! you get the picture. Ok,rant over. Jul 24, 2013 5:34pm. If you agree with the silly premise of this article, then as prosecutor you have to name the other four members of the band in your 'murder' allegation -- or do you actually believe Mike Patton held them at gunpoint and in International Environments, made them make music they didn't also believe in? There are few innovative bands you could name that are innocent of shitty bands following them down the trail they blazed. Jul 28, 2013 10:29pm. I love both eras, personally.
But please acknowledge that the stereotypes, music for The Real Thing was written before Patton even joined. It was only on Angel Dust that Patton actually got to in International Essays, work on the material. Other than that, this article was pretty poorly thought out. Youth! Judging an entire era of a band via a couple of singles and the horseshit that they unintentionally spawned, as well as arguments like errgh, Beastie Boys samples that might as well have been scraped off Wikipedia without even listening to the track you're referring to. Aug 21, 2013 8:40am. I think you're wrong about Kid Rock, Linkin Park, Insane Clown Posse and Limp Bizkit being direct descendents of Faith No More. They may namecheck them but they're really all just diet Rage Against The Machine. Now if you'd like to talk to talk about a baand that spawned some awful awful imitators, it would be them. Also, all those shitty funk metal bands were beholden to marshall father, the RHCP rather than Faith No More but that blows a hole in your basic premise, so. Aug 28, 2013 1:41am.
Yeah well, chuck Mosley ruined Courtney loves fnm lol. Sep 7, 2013 1:51pm. Pretty interesting and well argued article actually, tho I don't like to admit that as I am equally a fan of youth, Pattons FNM as Moselys. I think Pattons (ongoing) legacy should be guaged more by donnie my undercover his subsequent solo/collaborative work than his influence on lesser following bands, and of course with FNM itself. I have often compared and contrasted the two FNMs in my mind and both have compensating differences. Both are very worthwhile artists with Moselys strengths being more humane relaying of stereotypes, personal relationships, and Patton's darker societal thought and imagery. Personally I see similarities too unflattering of both of them, with lyrical no no's and the occasional bizzare indulgence in their attempts to convey meaning. They could be equally as wacky then both with words and visuals, check out let me go essays video of youth, We Care A Lot for Moselys equally colourful bouncing and outfit!
Not really that different to Epics cartoonishness. Lastly, Patton in my opinion was contributer to Ethics in International Environments, a progressing and stereotypes, varied musicality, albeit darker at times. And for a much more different personality there was actually a good deal of the and Purpose of Higher Education Essay, original FNM that was preserved. Taste, ey? Sep 19, 2013 7:45pm.
Chuck Mosley sucks, Mike Patton is the greatest! This article was written by youth stereotypes a piece of white. Sep 19, 2013 7:48pm. . meant to write piece of shit . not sure how auto-correct managed to never let me go essays, fuck that up. Oct 5, 2013 4:22pm. So, basically what you're saying is that you liked them before they were popular? Oct 8, 2013 3:30pm. Who is this douchebag to determine ultimately what good music is, and stereotypes, what isn't? If you like the Chuck era, listen to the two music, their first two albums and stereotypes, leave it at that. If I said I only The Benefits of Higher Education Essay, like the pre-Wylde era of Ozzy, then I wouldn't go on youth, some dumbass, moronic, totally biased rant dissing Zakk Wylde, Ozzy Osbourne, all similar music and all the fans.
Good music isn't a genre of donnie brasco: my undercover in the, music. It's a judgement made by stereotypes each individual listener as to what they personally like to in International Environments Essays, listen to. You're a prick. Oct 8, 2013 3:38pm. If you absolutely hate this kind of music, then make your own. Do something better. Prove to us and the other bands like Faith No More, Primus, Infectious Grooves,how much better of a musician/composer you are.
Then MAYBE we will all acknowledge this article as legit. Oct 12, 2013 5:15am. Are you out of youth, your mind? Angel Dust and King for a Day are goddamn MASTERPIECES. Oct 17, 2013 6:57am. A series in events in no particular order as a result of the first comment I read on the third last time that we met (THINK about staff discount, it. we've met before) has led me to believe that pigeons (Chuck) spread disease and mess up the place. Stereotypes! Change places with furniture the way a ghost would do it. Mike Patton is GOD. Please continue to blind yourself to the fact. Marshall Mathers Father! It makes us ALL SMILE. Nov 17, 2013 11:06am.
I wish to see you punched repeatedly about the face and neck. Youth! Following this, I will pay a homeless man minimal monies to make mouth love to you. This is fair. Dec 3, 2013 12:04pm. Hi Jamie. I'm guessing what you're really saying here is Ethics in International that you don't like Faith No More's - The Real Thing album? This article is the most unsubtle attempt at youth stereotypes trolling FNM fans I've ever seen on the internet.
. Of Baroque! Angel Dust over-hyped? Angel Dust was pretty much a flop in stereotypes, the US. So where were they over-hyped? But then you concede that Angel Dust is a very influential album. Brasco: Life In The Mafia! So . the stereotypes, hype was . sorta about right then? Then you write a load of garbled journo-speak about Korn and FNM covering Easy. Rhetoric with no substance. Education! Totally your biased (and at youth stereotypes that point irrational) negative opinion. Essentially ending with you cancelling out your whole argument by in International Environments saying you can't blame FNM for the shit bands they influenced. And besides, you admire Patton's credentials.
Pointless ill-informed rubbish. Maybe I could get a job writing for youth, you guys, I don't have any experience and I have a vague grasp on of baroque music were, the English language, but you seem to print any old bollocks, so I'm definitely more than qualified. Should I submit my CV? Dec 3, 2013 12:13pm. Please re-read this paragraph: And – oh God – how could I forget the countless dreadful provincial metal bands with serious delusions of stereotypes, grandeur – the kind that think the more strings on your bass you have, the more serious a musician you are; and kind of band that sees nothing out in International Environments Essays of the ordinary in youth stereotypes, performing a cover version of in International Essays, a someone else's cover. Yes, these are the fools who would bust out a version of stereotypes, 'Easy' in the middle of the two of baroque, a set of youth stereotypes, otherwise stilted funk-metal accompanied by The Benefits and Purpose of Higher Essay Ooh, let's see what this preset does keyboard flourishes. If Faith No More thought they were being challenging and youth stereotypes, didactic by paying tribute to The Commodores, they vastly overestimated their fanbase's resourcefulness and willingness to broaden their horizons. If anything, the opposite occurred – it gave Patton's acolytes a molehill of superiority to sit upon The Benefits Education and broadcast their new-found expertise on soul music: Well, I love 'Easy', of course, but nothing else really grabs me. Youth Stereotypes! (If it was any good, Faith No More would have covered it, wouldn't they?) Indeed, interviews with Patton and his bandmates towards the end of the brasco: life in the, 90s displayed a marked unease at how simple it was to toss out half-formed ideas and stereotypes, have their audience honk and slap their flippers together in approval. They really should have called that 1991 live album: How Shall We Fuck Off, O Lord? What is this bollocks?
It's like a word stew of bitterness. Environments Essays! There's nothing in this even remotely connected to reality: more strings on stereotypes, your bass - essentially saying, ugh I hate Korn and pretentious metal bands Yes. OK. So what the fuck has that got to do with FNM or Patton? Faith No More thought they were being challenging and didactic by paying tribute to The Commodores Did they? Citation needed. it gave Patton's acolytes a molehill of superiority to sit upon and broadcast their new-found expertise on soul music: Well, I love 'Easy', of course, but nothing else really grabs me. In International Environments Essays! (If it was any good, Faith No More would have covered it, wouldn't they?) Has anyone ever actually uttered those words? What a massive amount of wank. Indeed, interviews with Patton and stereotypes, his bandmates towards the end of the 90s displayed a marked unease at how simple it was to toss out staff half-formed ideas and have their audience honk and slap their flippers together in approval Yea?
Evidence of this? Any shred of youth stereotypes, it? Cheers. Dec 8, 2013 2:54am. I think you also failed to mention that his voice is. Amazing and can't be compared to the like of.
Chucky who actually failed faith no more because. Of his lack of mathers, direction and commitment. I also think you will find that the epic video was actually. A very sinister and sarcastic point of view from mike. Patton and youth, not meant to be taken seriously. Or be an example of marshall, what the band or mike patton. In actual fact when glam rock was still at stereotypes a peak.
Mike patton bought back the 80's with his spandex aerobic. Thank god!! For mike patton taking on the front. Man position otherwise you wouldn't be talking. About FNM at all and Ethics in International Environments, it wuld have been just another. Try hard in stereotypes, hit wonder band instead of.
Being album of the year Dec 18, 2013 7:05am. A ridiculous, immature, and ultimately ignorant article. Jan 16, 2014 2:38pm. I think it's fairly obvious that Chuck Mosley was a limited frontman in comparison to Patton's versatility and vocal range.
Jan 18, 2014 4:21am. Haha this article sucks, mike didn't murder fnm, i see your point but ur a needle in a haystack and i cant agree cuz i love pattons music n the and Purpose Education, only reason fnm is youth enjoyable now, yes ppl have different opinions but your article n approach is wrong n as u can see, no one agrees with you. Jan 18, 2014 4:28am. Also to Education Essay, mention, i have a great respect for patton to youth, see that, kuz hes a lead singer in a band he dosnt feel like that makes him more than the band, his words the donnie my undercover life mafia, voice is an stereotypes, instrument chuck let the band down for abuse n thinking he was more than the band, if he stayed fnm would of Ethics Essays, failed as a band, there words. Mar 14, 2014 10:43pm. yep, the man has gone full retard, which of course you should never do. ever.
Mar 15, 2014 4:14am. I had to stereotypes, scroll up after reading to make sure I wasn't on never let me, TheOnion. While some of the songs on We care a lot and introduce yourself were good, NEVER once did I think Chuck Mosely could sing, at all. Those were studio albums, albeit low budget albums, but still studio albums. Youth Stereotypes! The singing on those albums is literally the best that he could do, and it sounded like a tone deaf drunk singing karaoke. Apr 2, 2014 2:08am. I only donnie in the, know one other person in the universe that thinks the same as this SHMUCK! A guy I went to high school said the youth, same thing, Mosely made FNM and Patton was a pretender. now at least I know that there are two WANKERS in this world. Apr 8, 2014 8:28am. You fail at music appreciation.
Nice link bait troll article. Loser. Apr 23, 2014 3:53pm. What a ridiculously ill-founded article.. Seriously.. I love Chuck era FNM, and, unlike you, i couldn't give a toss what colour Patton is- i thought he was a woman when i first heard From Out of Nowhere open up the Real Thing. If the rest of the group had limped along without finding a replacement you could have written an giants, article entitled ' How Chuck Mosley Killed FNM ' - it's two different groups, like it for what it is. Stereotypes! Your article is peppered with shallow, embittered and never, borderline offensive assumptions and youth stereotypes, judgements. Marshall Father! And you glaringly miss the point or indeed the irony of youth stereotypes, a lot of Patton era FNM- That's your opinion, you're entitled to it just as i am to point out you are a bit of father, a fool. May 1, 2014 1:08pm. Lmfao shite article that nobody agrees with apart from youth stereotypes, tone deaf Chuck!
May 11, 2014 3:49pm. rich mullins wrote a song called awesome god back in the day before I got asked to leave the mathers father, church and I remember pastor rick used to warn us not to use the stereotypes, word awesome in our everyday language unless we were talking about god. yeah so maybe I went out of my way to Ethics in International Environments, break that rule. but anyways mike patton did the same thing with the youth stereotypes, word epic. and to this day I can't help but think of father, him whenever I read or hear the word. Mike Patton is God. May 22, 2014 10:10am. But then I see him bouncing around like a twat in that video for Epic. You have completely missed the point. He was taking the piss out of Anthony Kiedis in that filmclip and thus spawned a feud that lasted for years. Jun 9, 2014 2:06pm.
Sorry but Patton changed the stereotypes, bad for mathers father, the better. I started with mosely, enjoyed the music , wasnt crazy about stereotypes, his vocal but introduce yourself had something different, something good. The real thing is not a great album lets be honest but after that things got really good. I saw them live 3 times in 2 years and they were so solid live. I have listened to all Patton's side projects, Mr Bungle, Tomahawk, Peeping Tom, Mr bungle etc, all very different but equally clever. His solo album in staff, Italian is stereotypes amazing. I'm sorry but if Mosely was so damn good he would be still around making music. Pattons soundtrack for never let me, the place beyond the pines has some beautiful pieces of music.
The man has a lot of talent. Jun 19, 2014 4:36pm. Agree with Tedbenson. Clickbait crud. More fool me - I clicked! This ignores the fact that Patton had no musical input on that first FNM album he did and wrote everything in two weeks. The hate seems to youth, be based solely on mathers father, the cringeworthy video for Epic, in which he comes across as Andrew WK's granddad, and youth stereotypes, not much else. Jul 6, 2014 1:58pm. This article is arse piss. Incredible bollocks. Jul 7, 2014 1:21am.
I saw Chuck Mosley ruin Bad Brains once. Maybe I should write an article about that. Jul 11, 2014 10:51am. Enlightening article. Donnie Brasco: Life In The! What do we learn? XY does not like MP. Stereotypes! If there's something you don't like - nazis, doughnuts, mike patton, . The Two Giants Of Baroque Music Composition! - don't waste your energy on them. It'll only make 'em stronger. Aug 23, 2014 8:57pm. Wow I can't believe what I am reading!
Mike Patton is easily one of the most if not the youth stereotypes, most multi-talented vocal genius's of our time. FNM in mathers father, my opinion was his weakest project but still way better than Mosley era FNM. Seems like any drunk dude could sing Mosley style vocals. Sep 25, 2014 11:34pm. the last thing the youth stereotypes, guy who wrote this gave five stars to was 90 minutes of brasco: my undercover life in the, pompous, tedious doom metal. Stereotypes! look it up on let me go essays, the guardian website. don't be bothered by stereotypes this, patton fans. Sep 26, 2014 10:41pm. Oct 14, 2014 4:42pm.
really liked your sentiments on mosley. Never Go Essays! i completely agree. for me , its two different bands, two different people. joy division, new order. ill never get the emotion and otherness i got with mosley from the stereotypes, cold, reptilian patton. In International! that said, mosley had to go - and someone had to youth stereotypes, step in. who would you have rathered? at least patton came in never let me, with his own vision, took the band to the top and youth, then to the left and then left further even. its was exciting. almost a twin peaks thing in that they had the public eye and and Purpose of Higher, still kept it fucking weird. certainly missteps and some of it absolutely cringeworthy. Youth! you got some balls though blaming all of staff discount, that shitty music on patton/fnm because they influenced others. why not blame every shitty band on the beatles? on youth stereotypes, chuck berry? on their moms? it was like blaming some nice guy named jesus for the crusades and all the atrocities that happened in his name. its a bullshit argument and really was just an opportunity for mathers, you to offend literally just about youth, everyone whose ever even heard of FNM. Donnie Brasco: My Undercover Life Mafia! esp that bit about Easy and the Commodores. who is your audience here bro? your ego? i'd take an unthinking moron who likes easy only cause patton told them it was good over someone who thinks as fucking wrong as you do. Youth Stereotypes! do you even read this shit before you submit it? you're a fucking cliche man in your obviousness. we get it, you make your own opinions. this one was embarrassing. also why are you playing dumb to donnie brasco: my undercover in the, pattons approach in Epic? that was a calculated move, a mocking the youth stereotypes, trends at the time and playing his cards smart - it worked. a weird fucking song and it got tons of never, attention. he was still working Bungle at that time, so its not like this was some preschool effort - it was a joke and you seem to be willfully missing the punchline for the sake of having something write/bitch about. btw- as much as i cannot stand patton fanboys, he was recently recognized to have greater range than anyone from diamanda galas to axle rose in the pop scene. might want to youth, show the littlest bit of respect and not essentially call him the granddaddy of limp bizkit or ICP. Oct 20, 2014 8:07pm. So the thing is, they where very popular with Patton. Fact this is the first I ever heard of marshall mathers father, Mosley but from what I'm seeing here not allot of people think he was really worth keeping. So we get the point you don't like change, but the fact is Rap was on MTV before Faith no more so skin tone had nothing to do with it. Yes MTV has an agenda, it has changed from stereotypes, back then but the fact is go essays they have always just used kids to do the same thing, to youth stereotypes, make what appears to be a good agenda into an agenda popularizing the of Higher, mega rich so the kids learn to youth stereotypes, bow down to their every wish. SURPRISE!! Hollywood are Government Lackey's.
That includes most of the Music industry. Faith no more creepy look into the future however never really was about Ethics Environments, looking into the future. I can't see where you get that actually, there is nothing futuristic about it but what there is, is youth stereotypes allot of CG work that to me peer more into of baroque music were the subconscious with all the secrets that it tries to youth, expose as you work your whole life trying to hide them, such is the never go essays, whole meaning of the song. Stereotypes! The fish at the end is a symbol of the and Purpose of Higher Education Essay, person slowly dying never really feeling like he / she belongs (Fish out of water). Have you ever even seen the video or where you just at youth work one day talking about it with some friends that saw it and hated it? Seriously we get the point, you hate change, you bashed the change of the band and with it you also managed to throw a dis to the alternate music world as well. Good for you, but if you really want to be so hateful and talk so much dreg, please I beg of you, learn about it a little so you know what you're talking about first.
Nov 25, 2014 10:06pm. It sounds like this guy's over-thought the fact that the whole album: 'the real thing', was put together not long after patton joined the band, and was really quite young himself, so the whole sound was sort of let me, immature. My understanding is that angel dust had quite a lot of record label input, as the band were touring a lot and stereotypes, time was spent doing that, which is what they lived for at that time. That's what shines through to donnie brasco: my undercover, me, post angel dust, their albums belie their live performances, and pattons voice started to lose the whineyness. Dec 1, 2014 9:57am. There is youth stereotypes a special place in my heart for primark staff, the Introduce Yourself album, but really. FNM would have NEVER had gotten as far as they did if it wasn't for youth stereotypes, them dropping chuck and bringing in Patton.
But with that said, truth be told.. Patton never took FNM that serious. He joined it to help promote Mr Bungle. Now days he has had a change of heart with and will be releasing a new album April of 2015 (as you all know). The Two Of Baroque Were! Im excited to see what the youth, album sounds like, the Im not a very big fan of the track 'Mother Fucker'. Jan 30, 2015 5:12pm. Chuck Moseley fnm and Mike Patton fnm are both great. I will concede that epic was shit, but as a whole the real thing was still a great record.
Also the real thing was a starting point for The Benefits Essay, Patton to youth stereotypes, find his stride with the band. The Benefits Education Essay! I personally feel that fnm had a great progression throughout their different records. Patton has such an expansive body of work and it all points to the fact that he is nothing if not a true artist. Feb 14, 2015 10:01am. Haha, the writer of this piece is 12 shades of cunt. Mar 4, 2015 3:04am.
EPIC FAIL YOUR ARTICLE! You look pretty dumb now that Faith No More is making a huge impact on youth stereotypes, the music scene. The FNM with Mike Patton. Primark! The only youth, FNM. He sings Chucks songs better than Chuck. Mar 11, 2015 12:42pm.
Faith No More are actually one of father, my favourite bands at stereotypes the moment. There is an easy listening element to them for me, as my taste generally ranges from heavy metal like SOiL and Korn right down to the softer stuff like Deep Purple and Thin Lizzy. Apr 16, 2015 2:20am. I would have thought a murder would follow almost instantaneously with a death of the murdered, but considering Faith No More produced a hell of a lot more music, loved and adored by millions of fans worldwide, I would say your whole article is just built on the premise that you dont like Faith No More's Mike Patton and preferred the the two of baroque composition, original singer Mosley. Big deal really.
Who cares? I'm sure some people prefer Depeche Mode over Metallica or Slayer over Mozart. Stereotypes! Its no news to the majority of let me, us who can grasp the concept of personal taste. Furthermore you havent really 'shot down' the youth, band, you've just told us you dont like them. It doesnt really mean anything, considering people judge music by never listening to it, not by some article written on stereotypes, the internet. Whats the point in in International Essays, all this Patton bashing anyway? Yeah everyone, even the most hardened FNM fans know he's always been a bit of a show-boy. Youth! So what..
Incase you havent realised, to The Benefits of Higher Essay, gain popularity requires more than just musical talent. May 31, 2015 4:57pm. What an insanely illogical, self-righteous, pretentious article. So, let me get this straight: one video made in 1990, and youth stereotypes, inevitably overplayed by MTV and let me go essays, commercial radio is the reason for youth, Kid Rock and Limp Bizkit? Wow. That's some pretty far reaching guilt by association. Primark Discount! FNM obviously blows your hip, edgy mind because you clearly don't understand the youth stereotypes, appeal or the timeless quality of their music. Like all great bands, they were a constantly evolving entity which never once compromised on the two giants music were, anything.
They could've done different versions of The Real Thing for the rest of stereotypes, their career, but instead chose to do whatever the Ethics Environments Essays, fuck they wanted, infusing dozens of youth stereotypes, different styles and influences. You never once mention King For A Day. Fool For a Lifetime, most likely because you never listened to primark discount, it. A brilliant album, and the first one which Patton really was the creative driving force behind it. I'm so glad you approve of Patton's side projects, and stereotypes, that they are able to rise to your level of taste. God forbid you finding them too commercial, or having any influence on Limp Bizkit. Jun 12, 2015 5:06am. Mike Patton is and Purpose Education Essay such an annoying character. Jul 28, 2015 2:37am. Ok so you have the unique perspective where Chuck was your favorite when the consensus is he sucked. The band apparently sort of youth, felt this way too that they got rid of of Higher Education, him and got Patton, but you in youth stereotypes, your infinite wisdom know so much better than they do.
Okay:). Sep 7, 2015 1:50pm. I just don't get the Chuck Moseley thing. Mike Patton on the other hand is donnie my undercover in the insanely talented, and I as approach middle age (no longer hoody but suit wearing) the Faith No More resurgence makes a lot of sense to me. They weren't (post-Real Thing) and aren't now pandering to any particular crowd, especially not the notoriously fickle, record-sale hating metal crowds. They can literally do anything, so they do. From Jizzlobber to youth stereotypes, covers of Burt Bacharach. That is genuine talent. And as I look back at my youthful self with elements of both of nostalgia and distate, it seems they are doing exactly the same. Oct 5, 2015 5:10pm.
You surely knew you were going to be mugged as soon as you posted this. Look. I like the donnie brasco: my undercover in the, Chuck stuff too, and there is youth always the marshall, tendency to think the record that got you into a band is their best. Your opinion that FNM with Patton is shitty is just an youth, articulation of that tendency. Never! FNM became a much better band with Patton - in youth stereotypes, virtually every criteria. More experimental, more progressive, better concerts, more sales, more influential - you name it. To your defense, you even say a lot of those things, but do it some sort of back-handed way that suggests that because more people dug it, more musicians were influenced by mathers father it, and larger crowds were pulled in to see it, that somehow that made it shitty.
The band that you got into changed, and I can understand your disappoinment, but in the end you need to stereotypes, get over it because the material they put out afterwords was just much better. Here we are 20 years later, and if there had been no Patton in FNM - no one would even have a clue who they are. Instead, they just put out in International a VERY RELEVANT new record and embarked on a tour that is youth one of the let me go essays, most sought after tickets to get. Neither would've happened with Chuck. Oct 19, 2015 12:58am.
Mar 29, 2016 5:29pm. Jamie, everyone is entitled to their opinion. However, mine is that yours is the youth, stuff that toilet paper is made for. First off, I'll admit to jumping on Ethics, The Real Thing bandwagon. Afterwards while exploring other albums I found out that Chuck was the original singer, and was excited to hear some of the older material. Youth Stereotypes! Disappointment ensued. The man was monotone, and the one tone wasn't that great.
He seemed way more into wearing the loudest clothes ever, and giants, less about the music. Youth Stereotypes! You don't have to like Mike, but it seems like most of the world does. You're opinion is the Ethics in International Essays, real epic fail whatever your name was. Aug 19, 2016 6:17pm. So did you see the news this week that Chuck performed last night with FNM? I went back and youth stereotypes, listened to Introduce Yourself. And I agree that it's a good album. Primark Staff! However Chuck's vocals are nothing to write home about. Angel Dust and youth, the material that followed showed much strong vocals supported by incredible songwriting.
Patton is in International Environments Essays one of the greatest live performers I've ever seen and continues to amaze me with his energy and stereotypes, humor. Aug 23, 2016 6:12pm. all of this credit to FNM is donnie brasco: my undercover in the mafia somewhat true to youth stereotypes, a degree. You gotta remember Patton was Mr Bungle's vocalist before any of his later endeavors and took the seat at the front of FNM as a way to get Bungle some exposure .. not that joining FNM was so much of giants of baroque music, a side project, but I think it's obvious that the experience and subsequent landing of John Zorn to produce the first Warner Brothers Mr Bungle release was cathartic in youth, revealing that ALL projects can be side projects if you are willing to put the work in. The big thing that no one seems to mention is that 1991 is slated as the donnie brasco: my undercover life in the, year the punk broke . Sonic Youth signed with D Geffen and so too did NIRVANA. yes, nirvana. Stereotypes! if you are going to concede anything about the skin color of the post og MTV generation, then you've got to include the white trash aesthetic of such bands formerly mentioned. Donnie Brasco: My Undercover In The Mafia! still surprised no one did. Best Of September '17. Best Of September '17.
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Tutorial: Create a Sample Report in Power View. Please visit the stereotypes, most up-to-date Power View documentation on office.microsoft.com. And Purpose Education! Power View is now a feature of Microsoft Excel 2013, and is part of the Microsoft SQL Server 2012 Reporting Services add-in for Microsoft SharePoint Server 2010 and 2013 Enterprise Editions. In this tutorial, you create a Power View report that demonstrates what Power View can do, using a small sample model created in youth, PowerPivot for Excel. Never! You create tables and convert them into a number of different visualizations. Youth Stereotypes! You create tiles and of baroque were, add visualizations to them. You create multiple pages, or views , in your report. You create a bubble chart and add a play axis to it, so you can see how the values change over youth stereotypes, time. You create small multiples – a set of small charts, one per never let me go essays series, with the same axes.
Then you experiment with different ways to youth filter the Ethics Environments Essays, data in the visualizations. In the end, you export your report to PowerPoint. To do this tutorial, you need to: Download and install Power View samples, including the image files, from the Download Center. For more information, see Power View and PowerPivot HelloWorldPicnic Samples for SQL Server 2012 in SQL Server 2012 Samples . HelloWorld_Picnic is a tiny sample data model that demonstrates how to set data model properties to youth stereotypes best present that data in Power View reports.
In the scenario, the data is used to plan and in International, track food and drink for picnics. For more information, see Power View Samples for SQL Server 2012. Before you can start the youth, tutorial, save the never let me, HelloWorldPicnicPowerViewRTM.xlsx file to a: SharePoint document library . If you save it to a SharePoint document library, create a shared data source that points to the HelloWorldPicnicPowerViewRTM.xlsx file that you saved to youth stereotypes the SharePoint document library. PowerPivot Gallery . If you save it to a PowerPivot Gallery, it doesn’t need the shared data source. You can open Power View directly from the my undercover in the mafia, gallery. Save the images to youth stereotypes the associated SharePoint document library. To create a shared data source (RSDS) file to The Benefits of Higher Essay point to the PowerPivot (XLSX) file. In Shared Documents, create a HelloWorldPicnicSQL2012 folder, and youth stereotypes, save the HelloWorldPicnicPowerViewRTM.xlsx file there. In the primark discount, HelloWorldPicnicSQL2012 folder, click the Documents tab, click the arrow next to New Document , and youth, then click Report Data Source . If there is no Report Data Source option on the New Document tab, then someone with adequate permissions on the SharePoint site needs to father add that content type to the site. For more information, see Add Report Server Content Types to a Library (Reporting Services in SharePoint Integrated Mode) . In the Name box, type HelloWorldPicnicRSDS . Note the RSDS file extension.
In the Data Source Type box, click Microsoft BI Semantic Model for Power View . The connection string for an XLSX file is the full URL to the file, including the file name. For example: For Credentials , click Windows authentication (integrated) or SharePoint user . Click Test Connection . You should see a message that the connection test was successful. Create an Images folder in youth, the HelloWorldPicnicSQL2012 folder. For example: In the Images folder, save the images that you downloaded from the Download Center. For more information, see the Prerequisites section at the beginning of this tutorial. To update the links to the images.
Open HelloWorldPicnicPowerViewRTM.xlsx in primark discount, Excel. On the stereotypes, PowerPivot tab, click PowerPivot window . If you don’t see a PowerPivot tab, you may need to of Higher Education Essay install PowerPivot for Excel. In the Items worksheet, find the URL in the Photo, Drawing, Category Drawing, and Category Photo columns. For example, the URL in the Photo column is: http://localhost/Shared Documents/HelloWorldPicnicSQL2012/HelloWorldPicnicImages/rs_crescent_picnic_image_. In each column, update localhost in the URL with the name of your server. If you saved HelloWorldPicnicPowerViewRTM.xlsx in a SharePoint Server 2010 document library, click the arrow next to the HelloWorldPicnicRSDS .rsds shared data source, and then click Create Power View Report . If you saved HelloWorldPicnicPowerViewRTM.xlsx to the PowerPivot Gallery, then click the Create Power View Report icon for HelloWorldPicnic . Power View opens with the blank view in the center, the stereotypes, ribbon across the top, and field list on the right. In the fields section of the field list are three tables. To begin with, the tables are collapsed, showing just their names: These tables make up the data model on which the Power View report is based. To expand the The Benefits Education, tables, click the arrows next to youth stereotypes the table names. Now you can see the fields in each table.
These may include calculated columns (marked with a Sigma ? symbol), measures (marked with a small calculator symbol), and Ethics in International, row label fields (marked with a gray and white icon). For more information about calculated fields and youth, measures, see Measure and never go essays, Non-Measure Fields in Power View . For information about the stereotypes, Power View design environment in general, see Power View Design Experience . To change the title text and marshall mathers, formatting. Click in the default title box and type a title: Picnic items . Select the text and click the Italic button, and then make the text Segoe (Bold) . Drag the sizing handle on the right side of the title text box to make it half the width and in the top-left corner of the view. Click the stereotypes, blank view. In the The Benefits and Purpose Education Essay, fields section of the field list, in the Items table, drag the Category field to the blank view. You now have a one-column table in the view. In the fields section of the field list, in stereotypes, the Quantities table, drag Sum of Qty Served to the one-column Category table. The table now has two columns with a total.
In the Visualizations gallery, click the let me go essays, Bar chart. Hover over the edge of the chart until the double-headed sizing arrows appear over one of the stereotypes, sizing handles. Drag the primark staff discount, sizing handle until you can see all the bars of the chart. Hover over the edge of the chart until the hand icon appears. The hand icon means you can move the youth, chart.
Drag the chart to the lower-left corner of the report for now. With the bar chart selected, on of baroque were the Home menu click Copy . You may see a message asking if you want to allow this Web application to access your clipboard. If you do, click Yes . Click off the bar chart on the blank canvas, and stereotypes, then click Paste . A second bar chart is pasted on the view. Make sure the copy of the chart is selected. In the layout section of the field list in the Axis box, click the arrow next to Category and then click Remove Field . In the fields section of the field list in the Items table, click the arrow next to donnie brasco: in the mafia the Distributors field and youth stereotypes, click Add as Axis . In the Visualizations gallery, click the Column chart.
In the in the mafia, fields section of the stereotypes, field list in the Quantities table, click the dropdown arrow next to the Sum of Qty Consumed field and click Add to Values . The chart is now a stacked column chart, with the Qty Served and Qty Consumed values stacked on top of each other. Click the dropdown arrow in Ethics Environments Essays, the Visualizations gallery and click the Clustered Column chart. Now the Qty Served and Qty Consumed values are side by side. Hover over the edge of the chart until the hand appears, and then drag the chart to the lower-right corner of the youth, report. Hover over the upper-right corner of the chart until the marshall mathers, double-headed sizing arrows appear. Youth Stereotypes! Drag the sizing handle until the chart is half as tall as the view, and half as wide. When you hover over the Distributors column chart, you see sort by Distributors asc . Click the arrow next to brasco: life in the Distributors and stereotypes, click Qty Served . Now the bars are sorted from smallest to largest quantity served. Click asc . It changes to desc , and the bars are sorted from Ethics largest to smallest quantity served. With the Distributors chart selected, click the Layout tab in the Chart Tools contextual tab, click Legend , and then click Show Legend at youth, Bottom . Drag the small Serve bar chart so that it is on top and in the upper-right corner of the large Distributors column chart.
By default, Category, the first chart you created, will be ‘behind’ or ‘under’ the second chart, Distributors. With the Category chart still selected, click Bring Forward . If you no longer have the never let me go essays, Category chart selected and it’s now completely covered by the Distributors chart, just select the Distributors chart and youth stereotypes, click Send Backward . You can filter and highlight data in your report in a few different ways. All of them allow you to select one or multiple values. To highlight one chart with another chart. In the Category bar chart, click the The Benefits of Higher Education Essay, fruits bar. Notice that the values in stereotypes, the Distributors column chart are highlighted to show the amount of never let me fruit from each distributor. Columns for distributors with no fruit are completely grayed. To clear the selection, click in the Category chart, but not on any bar.
Click the blank part of the view, so none of the visualizations are selected. In the Items table in the fields section of the youth, field list, select Category Drawing. On the Design tab, click Slicer . The slicer contains four filtering buttons. Each button features the image of one of the Education, four categories. If you don’t see the images of the categories, the images may be missing. See the section about saving images in Before you start the tutorial. Drag this slicer to the upper-left corner of the view, under the title. Resize it so you can see all four categories. Click the blank part of the view, so none of the visualizations are selected. In the youth, Items table in the fields section of the field list, select Drawing. On the Design tab, click Slicer . This slicer contains filtering buttons, one for in International Environments, each item, with an youth stereotypes, image for the two giants music were, each item.
Drag it to the right of the Category Drawing slicer and make it as tall as the view allows. Click one of the categories in the Category Drawing slicer. Note the behavior is different from highlighting in the chart. It filters everything in stereotypes, all the visualizations on the report, rather than just highlighting. For example, the Categories bar chart now just has one bar -- the category that you’ve selected in the slicer. The Distributors column chart just has the columns for the distributors in that category.
It filters the items in the other slicer. If you select beverages in the Category Drawing slicer, then the Drawing slicer will have only Ethics Essays beverages. To show all values again, click the Clear filter icon in the upper right corner of the youth stereotypes, slicer. Click the blank part of the view to start a new visualization, and then in the fields section of the field list, click the Items table name itself. A table is created automatically with the fields Name, Category, Color, and Drawing. These are the default fields in this table, as defined in the model on which this report is built. With the table selected, in the fields section of the field list, in the Items table, click the Distributors field. It is added to the table. With the table still selected, click the arrow to expand the of Higher Education Essay, Visualizations gallery, and then click Card . Drag the scroll bar on the right of the card to scroll through the rest of the cards.
Note the youth, name and image are prominently displayed in each card. This is the result of properties set in the model. With the cards selected, drag the Drawing field from the fields in the card listed in in International Environments, the Fields box in the layout section of the field list to the Tile by box in the layout section. This creates a series of tiles in a container, one tile for each value in the Drawing field. Notice that the card in the tile no longer has a scroll bar. It is filtered to the value in the Drawing field. Take a moment to click the different fruits in the tab strip along the top of the tile container. See how the data in the card changes. Drag the sizing handle on the right of the card to make the card taller than it is wide.
Hover over the edge of the youth, tile container until the hand appears, and then drag the primark, container to the upper-right corner of the report, next to the title. You drag a tile container by clicking the edge – not by clicking in youth, the tab strip. For tips on primark selecting, moving, and resizing visualizations, see “Working in the view” in Power View FAQ, Troubleshooting, Tips, and youth, Tricks. Select the tile container. Drag the right handle of tile container to make it three times as wide as the card.
Click in the tile container, but not the card. In the fields section of the field list, in the Dates table, select the Month Name field. This starts a new table in the tile container. In the let me go essays, fields section of the field list, in the Items table, select the Name field. In the fields section of the field list, in the Quantities table, select the Sum of Qty Served field. In the Visualizations gallery, click the Line chart. The line chart has a legend, but you do not need it because the chart contains just one line for the food item on stereotypes the tile.
With the line chart selected, on the Layout tab in the Chart Tools contextual tab, click Legend , and then click None . Make the chart wider to show the names of all the months. You can resize the card and line chart inside the tile container, independent of the container, but you may need to make the container bigger first. Click the different foods in donnie in the, the tab strip along the top of the tile container. Notice that the card and line chart in the tiles change to show values for the selected food. But also notice that none of the other visualizations in the view change.
They are not controlled by the tile container. Click the tile container, and on the Design tab in Tile Visualizations , click Cover Flow . You may need to resize the tile container to fit the card and chart. Again, click the food items in the cover flow, or drag the slider, to show values for different food items. Now that you have several different visualizations in stereotypes, one view, you can see how filtering and highlighting differ among them. Select a bar in the Category bar chart. Notice that it: Highlights related parts of the other chart. Filters the items in the tile.
Has no effect on the slicers. Clear that selection by clicking in the bar chart but not on The Benefits of Higher Education a bar. Select a category in the Category Drawing slicer. Notice that it: Filters both charts, removing the unrelated bars and columns. Filters the items in the tile. Filters the values in the Drawing slicer. Your report can have more than one view. Youth Stereotypes! You can add a duplicate of an existing view or add a new blank view.
All the marshall father, views in a report are based on youth the same model. On the Home tab, click New View . Select the Essay, title text box and press Delete. Scatter charts display two measures and bubble charts display three. Click the new blank view to start a new visualization. In the fields section of the field list, in the Items table, select the youth stereotypes, Category field. In the fields section of the field list, in the Quantities table, select the Qty Served YTD (year-to-date) and Sum of Qty Served measures. Notice that the numbers in each column are the same, because the quantity consumed year-to-date has no date to reference.
Click the Scatter chart button. Drag one of the donnie my undercover in the, sizing handles to make the youth stereotypes, scatter chart larger. In the fields section of the field list, in the Quantities table, drag the Sum of Qty Consumed measure to the Size box in the Chart Fields layout section. This is a snapshot of the totals. The values on the X and Y axes are the same.
If you add a date component, you can see how the let me go essays, values change over time. In the fields section of the youth, field list, in the Dates table, drag Month Name to the Play Axis box in the Chart Fields layout section. In the bubble chart, click the play arrow next to Month Name. The bubbles move, grow, and shrink as their values change over never let me, the months. Notice that the months display as watermarks in the upper-right corner, and the bubbles move to the right as the months pass and the year-to-date quantity increases. If the bubble chart is very small, you may not see the youth stereotypes, watermark. Click one of the bubbles.
This does two things: It draws a line tracing the path of that bubble over father, time. If there are other visualizations on the view, it highlights the value of the bubble in the other charts on the report and youth, filters the the two of baroque were, tiles to that value. To see the bubbles even better, you can ‘pop out’ the chart: hover in the upper-right corner of the chart and click the popout icon. Now the chart appears to stereotypes take up the full view, but only temporarily. The rest of the report is still the marshall father, same underneath, and when you click the youth stereotypes, popout icon again, the chart returns to its spot in the report. With one bubble selected and the chart popped out, click the play arrow again. Watch as the bubble traces its path. To return the bubble chart to its original size, click the popout icon again.
Drag the bubble chart to the upper-left corner of the view. Sometimes grouping the bubbles in a scatter or bubble chart by category makes the information clearer. To add category group colors to a bubble chart. Drag the Name field from the fields section of the composition were, field list to the Details box in the layout section of the stereotypes, field list, replacing the Category field there. Now the bubble chart has one bubble for every item. It makes a busy chart.
Drag the Category field from the fields section of the field list to the Color box in the layout section of the field list. Now the bubbles are colored depending on the category to which they belong. Click a category name in mafia, the legend. Notice that it highlights the items in that category in the bubble chart. With tiles and slicers, you can see a series of charts filtered to stereotypes a specific value. In this tutorial, the tiles filter the data to show the value for one of the foods.
The slicers filter the report for one or more categories of mathers father food. With small multiples, you can see data in a series of small charts side by side. Click the blank part of the view next to the bubble chart to start a new visualization. In the fields section of the field list, in the Dates table, click the Month Name field. In the fields section of the field list, in the Quantities table, click the Sum of Qty Served field.
In the Visualizations gallery, click the Line chart. This line chart shows quantities for all foods by stereotypes, month. Drag the left and lower sizing handles to make the chart bigger. In the fields section of the field list, in the Items table, click the Name field and drag it to the Vertical Multiples box in the layout section of the field list. By default, it creates a visualization that displays nine multiples at a time. They are a little crowded. With the The Benefits Education, small multiples chart selected, on the Layout tab in the Chart Tools contextual tab, click Grid . Drag to select three multiples across and two multiples tall. Now you see six multiples at a time, so you can see the individual multiples better.
To see them even better, pop out the youth, chart: hover in staff discount, the upper right corner of the chart and click the popout icon. The small multiples now fill the entire design space. Again, this has no effect on the other visualizations in the view. To return it to its original size, click the youth stereotypes, popout icon again. Drag the small multiple container to the lower-right corner of the father, view. Like slicers, view filters filter the whole view, but not other views in a report. One advantage of view filters is that they don’t take up any space on the view. Another is that advanced filters provide much more flexibility: For example, you can search for parts of values, rather than just a whole value. Visualization filters are similar to view filters but they filter individual visualizations on a view, rather than the whole view.
On the youth, Home tab, click Filters Area. In the never go essays, fields section of the field list, in the Dates table, click Date and drag it to the filters area. In Basic Filter Mode , you can select individual dates. Click the Advanced Filter Mode button to the right of Date. Click the arrow next to is on or after , and then click is on or before . Click the calendar and youth stereotypes, click August 31, 2011.
Click apply filter . This removes dates after August 2011. Hover over the vertical multiples and then click the filter icon in the upper-right corner of the visualization. Notice that the fields in in International Environments, the visualization are already in the chart filters area. In the filters area, click Sum of Qty Served. Drag the right end of the slider so the highest value is 400. Notice that the youth, Values axis for the multiples has now changed. The highest number is now 400. In the bubble chart, the Y value, also Qty Served, is unchanged – the maximum is still 600. You can preview your report, and you can view it in presentation mode. In both modes, the report is still interactive. When you click bars or columns in the charts, it filters and highlights the marshall mathers, rest of the report.
However, the field list and ribbons are absent, so you cannot add fields and create visualizations, or move or resize existing visualizations. Also, your interactions will not be saved with the report. On the youth, Home tab, click Reading Mode . Notice that the filters area is still visible. Click the icons in the lower-left corner or the numbers in life in the, the lower-right to move from one view to youth the other. Try some of the interactions you’ve tried earlier in primark, the tutorial: Click bars, columns, or bubbles in the charts.
Click different foods in the tile container. Click an item in a slicer. From here, you can return to design mode or go to full-screen mode with the buttons in the upper-left corner. Youth Stereotypes! Click Edit Report . On the Home tab, click Full Screen . Notice that the giants composition, filters area is still visible. Try some of the interactions you tried earlier in reading mode.
Click ESC to leave full-screen mode. On the File menu, click Save or Save As . The Save As dialog box contains the location of the model on which your report is built. You can change that location, saving the report to a subfolder, for example, but you must save the report to youth the same SharePoint server as the model. Give the brasco: life in the, report a unique name. We recommend a name that identifies the model on which the report is built. Keep the Include an image of each view in its current state as a preview for other users (in PowerPivot Gallery and other applications) check box checked. For more information about these preview images, see Choose Whether to youth Save an mathers father, Image of Each View with the Report . You can export your report to PowerPoint.
It has the same interactivity that it has in reading and full-screen modes. On the File menu, click Export to PowerPoint . Browse to where you would like to save the new PowerPoint file. You can save it anywhere, as long as it can connect to the report stored on the SharePoint server. Open the PowerPoint presentation. Each Power View view has been added to a separate slide. In PowerPoint design mode, each is static representation of the view. If you didn’t choose to stereotypes save a preview image when you saved the report, then you don’t see a static representation of the view in staff, PowerPoint design mode. Make any changes you want in the PowerPoint presentation. You can resize Power View views in PowerPoint, but you can’t edit them. In PowerPoint, click Slide Show . In the stereotypes, lower-right corner of the slide, click click to interact . Now you can interact with the view in the same way that you can in reading and the two giants music composition were, full-screen modes.
Now that you’ve completed this tutorial, you are ready to try using your own data in youth, Power View. To learn more about building data models for use with Power View, try Tutorial: Optimize a Sample PowerPivot Model for Power View Reports .
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Energy, ecology, and economics revisited. We must understand the concept of net energy in order to see the underlying energetic basis for society. Yet net energy is stereotypes, often misunderstood, typically through optimistic measures of valuation that do not address the hidden inputs. Perhaps HT Odum’s clearest, simplest, most understandable paper on the topic was written 40 years ago, in a special issue of the Royal Swedish Academy of Science’s Energy in Society issue of Ambio (1973). The article was republished in The Benefits of Higher Essay, Mother Earth News, still available online through Minnesotans for Sustainability. The paper remains as relevant and fundamental to the arguments for net energy today as it did 40 years ago. Each time I read the paper, I find new meaning from it.
Perhaps it is time to revisit the principles quoted below from the paper, to update the terms and give modern examples of the interrelationships between the 3Es of energy, ecology, and youth stereotypes, economics. Some of the The Benefits and Purpose of Higher Education, terminology and youth stereotypes, accounting methods have been refined over time, but the general principles remain unchanged–principles that are essential to the energy dialogue. 1. “The true value of energy to society is the net energy, which is what’s left after the energy costs of getting and concentrating that energy are subtracted.” All processes in the world involve energy, materials, and information. Materials are transformed through energy, which drives the process of creating every good, service, and environmental process.
Information guides the process of never go essays, transformation. Energy has different qualities, so a calorie of one form of energy is youth, not the same in quality as a calorie of another form, as certain forms of energy are not substitutable, depending on the situation. A calorie of sunlight may not be substituted for a calorie of oil or of food. Ethics Environments. In order to compare apples and oranges, we need to youth, create a common denominator. So all processes can be assessed or valued on a common basis using a lowest-common-denominator unit of The Benefits and Purpose Education Essay, solar energy—the seJ (solar emjoules). The science of Emergy accounting places values on the energy, information, and materials in the processes, allowing us to choose more efficient policies.
Emergy is defined as the youth, available energy of one kind that is primark discount, used up in transformations directly and youth stereotypes, indirectly to make a product or service. Real wealth, then, can be measured as the emergy memory that exists in human goods and services, and in non-human environmental goods and services. Odum’s updated term for net energy is net emergy or net empower. The true cost of a process to society is the net emergy, which is the emergy delivered after the emergy costs of and Purpose of Higher Essay, getting and concentrating that energy are subtracted. Net emergy contribution of any process within the economy including energy production can be calculated using an Emergy Yield Ratio, which is the net energy yield of youth, a process expressed in emergy, divided by the purchased goods and services, which are also expressed in emergy. Father. The EYR includes the youth stereotypes, contributions for renewable and the two giants composition were, non-renewable sources, and inputs such as human labor/services and environmental contributions, using a quality correction factor for energies of different qualities. Net emergy is an essential concept in the science of descent, during a period of waning energy availability. Brown, Cohen, Sweeney, 2009.
2. “Worldwide inflation is driven in part by youth, the increasing fraction of our fossil fuels that have to be used in getting more fossil and other fuels.” An updated explanation of this phenomenon can be found in staff, Energy Basis for Man and Nature (Odum Odum, 1976, pp. 49-59), as summarized by Hanson, “The buying power of money is the amount of real goods and services that it can buy. If the amount a dollar can buy diminishes, this is called inflation. Youth. Inflation can be caused by increasing the amount of money circulating without increasing the amount of energy flowing and doing work, for example, when more money is printed. It can also occur when the money supply is constant but less work is done, for never let me go essays example, because energy becomes scarce. As long as there is unused fuel energy to youth, be tapped, increasing the money supply can increase the flow of energy through the system, causing growth as well as some inflation.” And in the current era of declining energy availability and expanding money supply and debt, the degree of inflation relative to Emergy is particularly egregious. The graph below illustrates the calculated steady decline of Emergy per dollar value of father, gross world product since 1970, demonstrating a loss in value of about 33%. Brown Ulgiati 2011 http://www.mendeley.com/research/understanding-global-economic-crisis-biophysical-perspective/
3. “Many calculations of energy reserves which are supposed to offer years of supply are as gross energy rather than net energy and thus may be of stereotypes, much shorter duration than often stated.” Because the emergy valuation method is notable for never go essays including human labor and environmental goods and services in the valuation of a process, the net emergy yield for energy sources tends to be lower than other methods that do not include all inputs. Below is a diagram from Chapter 3 of youth, a pending book by Mark T. Brown and Sergio Ulgiati on Emergy and environmental accounting, posted here with permission. An in depth discussion of the history and fundamentals of the various method will be included in the book. One can see the different inputs that are considered in various types of accounting methods for energy production and other processes. If one were to include a fifth diagram reflecting the traditional economic demand-based approach, which does not measure environmental contributions, then that diagram would be even simpler, with a single-arrow output that is viewed or measured by the purchaser’s subjective ideas about willingness to pay, with minimal consideration for the inputs and no regard for limits of environmental contributions.
It would be helpful to this discussion if we examined the never, various energy accounting methods and the ranges of stereotypes, net energy estimated from mathers father each one, and placed them on a continuum. That exercise would show how scattered the valuations are, with varying rates of optimism. But that is not today’s goal in stereotypes, this post. From a pending book by Brown and Ulgiati, chapter 3, used with permission. The goal of this post is to re-examine Odum’s statements of 40 years ago in light of the current science. Marshall Mathers. In the period after Odum wrote the Ambio paper, Emergy scientists developed emergy accounting and calculated the net emergy or EYR for a variety of renewable energy and nonrenewable energy reserves. The ranges in the table below show values of EYR for a number of settings and processes over several decades. Net emergy is declining over time for these sources, so many of these values are now lower than what is published in the table. How many wrong policy guesses have occurred in stereotypes, various countries attempting to produce marginal sources?
What are the environmental impacts of trying to produce marginal sources such as fracked natural gas, tar sands, shale oil, aquaculture, ethanol, and palm oil? How many wrong guesses on net energy policies are we allowed? Odum, 2007, p. 201. 4. Marshall. “Societies compete for economic survival by Lotka’s principle (1922), which says that systems win and dominate that maximize their useful total power from all sources and flexibly distribute this power toward needs affecting survival.” Odum refined the idea of Maximum Power from Lotka (1922) as a proposed 4th energy law, and its corollary, Maximum Empower. Individuals and stereotypes, systems that maximize energy flow and power flow (empower) through systems have an advantage in competing with other systems for available energy. Systems develop mechanisms of feedbacks, high quality storages, and systems of exchange to maximize energy flow (see diagram above). For examples of this in Ethics in International Essays, modern economies, look at the United States.
After World War II, our intact infrastructure and youth stereotypes, rich natural resources allowed us to maximize power through rapid expansion of energy production, development of a high quality education system, and domination in world trade. These means allowed us to overtake other countries in mathers father, the development of technology, information, and military might. All of those adaptations served to improve feedback loops in our competition for even more resource acquisition. Power begets more power. 5. Stereotypes. “During times when there are opportunities to expand one’s power inflows, the survival premium by Lotka’s principle is on rapid growth even though there may be waste.” Using this same example, America’s empire development in the 1950s and 1960s resulted in rapid expansion of giants of baroque music composition were, energy production, industrialization, highway systems, suburbanization, industrial agriculture, and finally a high-tech information society.
Competitive and youth stereotypes, predatory capitalism, an expansive, debt-based financial system, and a large construction industry promoted rapid growth which gave the United States a great advantage in global trade, creating inequities and power imbalances. 6. “During times when energy flows have been tapped and there are no new sources, Lotka’s principle requires that those systems win that do not attempt fruitless growth but instead use all available energies in The Benefits of Higher Education, long-staying, high-diversity, steady-state works.” from Mark T. Stereotypes. Brown’s Democracy Lecture. When Odum wrote this paper 40 years ago, he was hopeful that global opinion and national policies could be changed through central planning so that societies could avert catastrophe by slowing growth and music, achieving a climax society in youth, relative steady state. But that did not happen. We are now in overshoot, and over mathers father, the past 40 years, signs that the United States and the world at large are slowly losing emergy flow per capita can be seen in indirect proxies such as failing wages, failing middle class, and collapsing empires. While some countries are doing better than others, the global trend in emergy flow is downwards. Maximum Power dictates that countries with less energy will adapt through increased efficiency. We can see this happening in the United States, for example, in slowing growth of various industries, including transportation and construction. 7. “High quality of life for humans and equitable economic distribution are more closely approximated in steady-state than in growth periods.” For points #7 and #8, I will let Odum’s words speak for themselves: “During growth, emphasis is on competition, and large differences in economic and stereotypes, energetic welfare develop; competitive exclusion, instability, poverty, and unequal wealth are characteristic.
During steady state, competition is controlled and eliminated, being replaced with regulatory systems, high division and never let me, diversity of labor, uniform energy distributions, little change, and growth only for stereotypes replacement purposes. Love of stable-system quality replaces love of never let me, net gain. Religious ethics adopt something closer to that of those primitive peoples that were formerly dominant in zones of the youth, world with cultures based on the steady energy flows from the sun. Socialistic ideals about distribution are more consistent with steady state than growth” (Odum, 1973, p. 222). 8. “The successfully competing economy must use its net output of richer-quality energy flows to subsidize the poorer-quality energy flow so that the discount, total power is maximized.” “In ecosystems, diversity of species develop that allow more of the energies to stereotypes, be tapped.
Many of the species that are specialists in Ethics in International Essays, getting lesser and residual energies receive subsidies from the youth, richer components. For example, the The Benefits of Higher Essay, sun leaves on top of trees transport fuels that help the shaded leaves so they can get some additional energy from the stereotypes, last rays of dim light reaching the mathers father, forest floor. The system that uses its excess energies in getting a little more energy, even from sources that would not be net yielding alone, develops more total work and more resources for total survival. In similar ways, we now use our rich fossil fuels to keep all kinds of goods and services of our economy cheap so that the marginal kinds of energies may receive the subsidy benefit that makes them yielders, whereas they would not be able to generate much without the subsidy” (Odum, 1973, p. 223). 9. “Energy sources which are now marginal, being supported by hidden subsidies based on youth, fossil fuel, become less economic when the hidden subsidy is removed.” Stephanie McMillan Code Green. There are many examples of marginal or net-negative energy sources that are only being produced because of hidden or overt subsidies. Of Higher Education. Hidden subsidies may consist of unfair trade, such as inputs to processes via expansion of empire, cheap goods from China such as solar photovoltaic panels, or rare earth minerals from Afghanistan. In an empire, many resources are subsidized through military actions or unfair trade that do not get calculated into costs of goods–yet these costs impact societal power.
Externalization of environmental damage is another large covert subsidy. Costs of goods do not include environmental costs of damage and pollution which get absorbed by the broader society over time. Overt subsidies include tax credits, production subsidies, or agricultural subsidies. Youth. How many overt or covert subsidies are involved in the creation of corn and marginal ethanol fuel in the diagrams below? Which components are not reflected in staff, the economic price? If you want to youth, learn more about this specific topic or what inputs contribute to an emergy analysis, the folio by Brandt-Williams (2002) analyzes the emergy basis including the inputs for 25 Florida agricultural commodities. Cambell 2008 Emergy Brief Comparative Corn Production 4 states. 10. “Increasing energy efficiency with new technology is Ethics, not an energy solution, since most technological innovations are really diversions of cheap energy into youth, hidden subsidies in the form of Ethics in International Environments, fancy, energy-expensive structures.” One of the ways that systems maximize empower is to develop high quality storages of information, materials, and energy that increase power inflows. New technology is stereotypes, highly transformed, energy-intensive machinery and processes that add to the transformity and emergy basis of let me go essays, processes.
Technology acts as a driver to promote faster use of energy. Youth. Technology in and of let me, itself cannot power a system. Youth Stereotypes. For example, high-tech GMO-modified seeds, pesticides, fertilizers, feed lots, aquaculture, and other technologies expand rates of power flow through the system, technology by itself is useless without energy. Technologies add to the emergy basis of produced foods. While the required other fuels, chemicals, and services allow larger yields in the short run, the system creates more wastes and is not sustainable when the The Benefits and Purpose, fossil fuel subsidies are withdrawn.
We are told that energy sources that are marginal at present will become producible in the future, through technological innovations. Stereotypes. We tell ourselves that smart grids and net metering will make solar photovoltaics the renewable resource of the 21st century. Or electric vehicles are touted as energy solutions, even though the solar emergy required for never let me an electric car is even higher than that of an internal combustion engine car, due to hidden costs of stereotypes, electricity, batteries, and new infrastructure. It is time for us to primark staff, look beyond the hoods of youth stereotypes, our cars at the real cost to society, beyond the sticker price. Ortega Miller-Soybean Comparison Odum, 1987, Crafoord Lecture, modified from A. Brown. So, forty years after the original article, what is Odum’s track record on accuracy? Except for his hopeful stance on marshall mathers, a climax steady state, Odum and stereotypes, colleagues’ estimates of which sources measure net benefits to society seem to be on track. This is primark, part 1–that’s enough for now. There are ten more important principles from that article to be covered in Part 2 at a later date. I’ve avoided discussing nuclear and solar photovoltaic in this first part of the series, as Odum covered those specifically in the ideas in the next section of his paper.
I am continually amazed, both at what your father understood 40 years ago, but also at how profoundly he’s been ignored over those 40 years. Why isn’t this part of basic high school curriculum? Why are so few people exposed to these concepts? Because HTO was a dangerous man. In a totalitarian system, he’d have been imprisoned, but in a capitalist “democratic” system, he’s simply out-shouted. Pity. Yes, heads can roll when paradigms shift. Net energy is youth stereotypes, so important, IMO it was HT’s most important contribution.
Yet we don’t even understand that one, relatively simple construct. Instead we get unicorns–magic technology: Every year I reread the primark discount, Ambio paper and ask myself, is the world ready to youth stereotypes, get it yet? See the above reply. Ah, that’s a really good one, Mary. Marshall Mathers. Really good. I’m always trying to figure out how we get to an “Emergy for stereotypes Everyone” exegesis of these critical concepts. This post is a real step in that. Jan said: “Because HTO was a dangerous man. In a totalitarian system, he’d have.
been imprisoned, but in a capitalist ‘democratic’ system, he’s simply. Exactly. But HT and his brilliant work is dangerous to the bosses and. what we now call the one-percenters. And it is they and their systems, incompatible with a world of reduced energy flows, that threaten us all. as a society and a species. But the much greater danger, of. course, is never let me go essays, that we will, collectively, continue to youth, fail to absorb and.
act on the insights that HT’s work has afforded us. If we do fail, it. will be despite your fine efforts. Brava! And thanks. Hmmm. Don’t understand the weird line breaks. Maybe need a techie consult. ;^) Hi, Doug. Never Go Essays. If you cut and paste something into Disqus, it picks up odd line breaks? Emergy for everyone–working on it.
It’s complex enough that I can’t start at youth the final product, which is the quantitative science of The Benefits and Purpose Education Essay, valuation. We have to begin with the reasoning behind net energy and stereotypes, the dialogue that led to the science–what is the energy memory of things, explained in words? I don’t think we’re able to see hierarchy in systems anymore. We are trained so thoroughly in breaking things apart and looking at the smallest piece we can find. Another Great Post. I especially appreciate those links to the somewhat “older” papers… In terms on ?how to transmit Odum?s science in a readable way, personally I entered thanks to brasco: my undercover life in the, David Holmgrens conceptualization of Permaculture – thats, it his words, “Systems ecology for the commons”… but still a bit difficult to youth, grasp for people with difficulties in abstract conceptual thinking… Another Great Post. I especially appreciate those links to the “older” papers… ?how to transmit Odum?s science in a readable way, personally I leared about never let me, Odums Energy Principles thanks to youth stereotypes, David Holmgrens conceptualization of Permaculture – it his words, PC was originally conceived as “Systems ecology for the commons”… but his book on that (Principles Pathways beyond Sustainability) is still a bit difficult to grasp for the more practical people. Thanks, Holger.
I haven’t read the book, but I suppose it goes on my list now. Here’s the cliff notes, apparently: “Essence of permaculture” is a very condensed version of the book…gives you a good idea of Davids writing style. Composition. The book is important, actually its even dedicated to H.T.Odum, and gave me a good idea of emergy concepts even before reading “A prosperous way down” and “Environment, Power Society” (the original version of 1971 and the update from 2008) – “Environmental Accounting” I have at youth home, but its a bit too difficult for Environments Essays me at the moment…needs time and concentration, and stereotypes, people to music were, discuss the ideas (i do not have them around here on the mexican countryside…) – a good synopsis of Davids book is here: http://permanentpublications.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/PR-Perm-Principles-Pathways-EMILY.pdf. Though still quite “cerebral” and (at least for many PC-folks) very theoretical conceptual, the 12 PC principles developed in the book (by themselves they represent a major renovation actualization of the PC Concept) translate the sometimes complex language of systems ecology into easy to remember and practical principles… definitely an stereotypes important read. Here you get the primark staff discount, book: and of course amazon. I’ve studied under Holmgren, and he is brilliant and has a wealth of information, but it’s too bad he didn’t hire a good editor, because his writing is all passive voice and rather academic. But it is a rigorous and well-crafted description of Permaculture. Chapter Three of Holmgren’s Principles and youth, Pathways is Odum 101.
I recall being shocked and Education, puzzled when I read that efficiency is youth stereotypes, not all it’s cracked up to be. I had to read that chapter over father, and over before I “got it.” Thanks again for stereotypes the links and Ethics in International, book recc. I’ve got the stereotypes, book, and Environments, it looks really good–I’ll get to it soon. Youth. Lots of hits on the website this morning, Jan. I went to see what the fuss was about. Manchurian Candidate? LOL.
Thanks for the props. And I really liked this explanation of yours: “There exists a “maximum power point” on the effort/efficiency curve. Go beyond that, and you’re into net diminishing returns, no matter how good things look. That Prius that gets 60 MPG? It took way more resources than a first-cut look at materials reveals. With its heavy reliance on hi-tech semiconductors and software, it requires essentially all of modern civilization to manufacture and maintain. I think my non-computerized diesels from the ’80s will be running long after the the two giants of baroque music composition, last electronic module for the Prius ceases to be available.
A skilled machinist in a large village or a small town can keep a mechanical diesel running on locally sourced fuels, but that Prius requires a global supply chain of exotic materials that require the long-distance transportation industry, semiconductors and stereotypes, software that requires much of the industrial education system, and billion-dollar semiconductor wafer fabrication plants that require the banking and finance industries. And we aren’t even to the point of discussing where the fuel comes from the two giants of baroque composition yet! (They are only rated “E85? — 15% ethanol, unlike the diesel that can run on 100% plant oil.)” It sounds like it’s time to take all of that frustration that you are venting in comments, and write a post for me on the topic of efficiency, max power, emergy basis? Consider this sentence, from Odum’s May, 1974 paper. It is why your father was ignored (and rightly so). “14. Energy is measured by calories, Btu’s, kilowatt hours, and other intraconvertible units, but energy has a scale of quality which is youth, not indicated by these measures.” You cannot just arbitrarily differentiate energy flow, entropy, the Laws of Thermodynamics and the rest of the natural world by and Purpose of Higher Education Essay, a new scale using a subjective category of “quality.” This is the theoretical flaw in “emergy.” Okay, so let’s give up on your new paradigm and look for an even newer paradigm – a metric that crosses all platforms. Joules will work; so will kilocalories. Kilocalories have the advantage of being known by just about youth stereotypes, everyone who reads. [And just ignore the The Benefits, nerdboys who insist on a difference in youth, kilocalorie measure from 14.5-15.5 C, versus 15.5-16.5 C.]
Using joules or kilocalories you can indeed compare the work done by a human to the work done by a bullock to the work done by a tractor. You can also compare the embedded energy in never go essays, the tractor to stereotypes, the embedded energy in a tiller. The Two Giants Of Baroque. [Embedded energy is still better than emergy because it is strictly quantitative.] Those who insist on a difference in energy (like your father and yourself) just provide a way for stereotypes the power brokers to keep everyone confused. If you just use joules or kilocalories you can devise your own methods of energy auditing – AND it is applicable across the in International, board (i.e. crosses all platforms). There is no big conspiracy here. It is just hard science. Emergy does use joules as a measure, Ralphieo. The difference in the joules of brain energy that is typing this response is different than the equivalent joule used to drive my car, or to grow a cabbage in stereotypes, my garden. They cannot be transposed. And the donnie in the mafia, joules of youth, brain and finger energy used to type this Disqus response is not just a couple of neurotransmitter exchanges at the axonal synapses and never let me go essays, finger muscles on computer keys.
This response is the result of my formal schooling, my upbringing, my cultural values that give me the passion, the knowledge of navigating the web and creating this website, and some small component of youth, both my Apple computer and the associated high tech company, and the overall internet that allows you and me to talk here, today, in this corner of the internet. Arguably, the joules of information energy being laid down in this response are of primark staff, much higher quality, with much higher transformity, with potentially much greater impact through the wonders of copied information. People say that electrons are free on the internet . . . Youth Stereotypes. well, that is only the case if you don’t see what went into the making of them. This is heresy and go essays, a huge emotional threat for youth engineers who see technology as the answer, through “free energy.” This business of not seeing the never let me, energy memory of youth stereotypes, things is the biggest blind spot in our energy sciences. The blind spot about the energy memory of things allows us to believe that we have created a free lunch, and that things are not as bad as they really are–that we can keep the current society and BAU. I just responded to Dwig’s excellent question about the relationship of power and efficiency on the previous Transformity post, and that explanation is useful here, so I will repost a paragraph of that response. Easy copying and Essay, sharing of youth stereotypes, information is Environments, a transformational use for the internet, even though we don’t see the true costs of both the internet and the original knowledge generation. Originals are expensive.
Copies are cheaper. Efficiency from a thermodynamic standpoint is the ratio of stereotypes, outputs to ALL energy inputs. including the “ultimate energy value of bought goods and services” (Odum Odum, 1976, p. 4). But the contributing energies are of different qualities, and are not always readily visible from the perspective of the high tech engineer at the top of the hierarchy, especially the environmental contributions. Odum states that “engineers should realize that most technological advances during the last century of marshall mathers, growth have involved the hidden, indirect, additional forms of energy. Stereotypes. As such forms of energy become less, many technological advantages will evaporate. Mathers Father. What was an advance becomes wasteful and must be discarded” (OO, 1976, p. Youth Stereotypes. 4). No it is not different. It is measured the same. It cannot even be measured! It must be calculated!
I don’t believe you are talking about the same thing that the rest of the of baroque music were, world is talking about when it comes to youth, emergy. Hmm, it seems to donnie my undercover in the, me that ralpheio is talking and thinking in terms of a different scientific discipline (based on his quote from youth stereotypes Wikipedia). There, heat is heat, no matter what its effects are. Odum, however, thought and worked as an ecologist; a given amount of Ethics Environments Essays, energy expended can do very different things in stereotypes, an ecosystem; in this context, the difference is very important. Here’s a loose analogy from economics: GDP as a measure of the US economy has been criticized because it counts all economic activity as equal. The expense of building a house and the expense of tearing down a house are measured equally, regardless of the donnie in the, value they add to the neighborhood (and yes, both can be valuable, but in different ways).
Another example: was Superstorm Sandy good for the economy? Certainly, it caused a lot of youth stereotypes, economic activity to occur. So, various measures have been proposed to capture the value added or destroyed by a particular economic activity. Thanks, Dwig and brasco: my undercover in the mafia, Jan. Youth. Ralphie, I’m not sure if you are really open to ideas, or if you’re stuck on details and dogma, or just venting your spleen in an anonymous venue. Please be polite if you want to converse here. The figure below illustrates a generic energy chain which transforms energy of lower, dilute quality into higher, more concentrated forms. Sunlight becomes plants, plants are eaten by bigger and bigger animals and humans, and plants become peat, which eventually becomes coal, and is extracted to create electricity by humans. For a joule to get to let me go essays, the higher levels and exist there, as a joule of electricity or a solar PV panel, or as DNA, or as information on the internet, it has been transformed many, many times, with associated very large losses in youth stereotypes, the form of heat entropy. Does a joule of primark, bear exist without the youth, supporting plants?
Does a joule of tiny energies on the internet exist without the supporting contributions from lower levels? No. And if it takes 4 or 5 joules of marshall, coal to create a joule of electricity, then there may be relative differences in the ability to do work. Complex work requires a lot of different kinds of high quality energy. Could we run our current society based on coal, without the electricity? No. Stereotypes. Can electricity based on the two giants of baroque were, renewables run our society?
No, not so much. Can we drop too many middle layers or power flow from loss of youth, nonrenewable energy and still have the higher levels function? Energy is transformed and upgraded through energy chains which store progressively higher quality energy as assets at each level, then feeding back at discount each level to promote pulling in more energy. Mary – You and Jan are being impolite, not me. If you are not willing to take criticism of your ideas without taking cheap shots, you are no scientist. The commentator, Dwig, gets it but still buys into youth, the abstract concept of emergy. Here is a tip for The Benefits and Purpose all of you. No matter how hard you try, you cannot alter the laws of physics. Youth. You can certainly define things differently, but it is merely a parlor game and your definition does not square with the real world. As the staff, Wikipedia entry says so succinctly, “The idea that a kilocalorie of youth stereotypes, heat is different is The Benefits of Higher, absurd.”
I’m not sure I understand you. Odum writes of “intraconvertable units” of energy, which you seem to say only applies to joules or kilocalories. Certainly one could also use ergs or dyne-centimetres or “barrels of oil equivalent” if one wished, because all these units are “intraconvertable.” Odum then goes on to note that not all energy is created equal, and thus Odum originated the concept of “EMbedded enERGY.” I agree that the ambiguous term “quality” itself lacks quality and precision. “Quality” generally refers to an immediate aspect of something, rather than a historical aspect. In the vernacular, a closely regulated source of precision flow of electrons might be thought of as a “high quality” energy source, whereas the chaotic, random nature of a lightening bolt could be thought of as lower quality because even though it may provide vastly more power than a typical 200-amp household electrical service, it’s nature is too unpredictable to youth, be of Education Essay, much practical use to anyone except for some plants that get off on the nitrogen it fixes. On the other hand, the embedded energy that goes into the making of a photovoltaic solar panel means that electrons from such a source have a different cost to youth stereotypes, them than do, for example, electrons coming from a coal-fired power plant.
So either I misunderstand you, or I think you may misunderstand the subtle meaning that Odum ascribed to “quality” in this context. Not all electron flows are created equal! Thanks, Jan, you addressed Ralphie’s question better than I, with more clarity. My head was still resonating with the issue of the two of baroque composition, energy memory, which is the application of the youth stereotypes, idea of quality. Education Essay. I agree that the stereotypes, word quality has been loosely used and open to misconstruction. Yes you misunderstood me.
Odum’s concept of embodied energy, or “emergy” was a way to differentiate between human energy and that of fossil fuels. In International Environments. It is a false distinction. Energy can be low-quality because it is dissipated over a large area, like sunlight. It can be high-quality because it is concentrated in a coal seam. However, regardless of its quality, it is measured the same – in joules, kilocalories, BTU’s etc.
Arbitrarily assigning a new qualitative category and youth, changing the measurement units to fit your arbitrary standard is not acceptable. Physics trumps politics. There is a very good reason for SI units (look it up). This is why Odum got no traction with his new units. I still think we’re talking past each other. Emergy units are not just another unit for primark staff expressing energy. No, emjoules are not at all the same thing as a statement of the energy they contain. You cannot burn a photovoltaic panel and obtain the stereotypes, amount of and Purpose Essay, heat implied by it’s emjoule content, any more than you can cool a cooked egg and get a raw egg back. This is not politics.
It is not some “arbitrary standard.” It is measuring a different thing. One might just as well say a kilowatt-hour or a light-year is just an arbitrary, political way of measuring time, simply because they sound like something other than what they are. I understand Systeme International units quite well, and kilocalorie is youth stereotypes, not even one of them, as it’s been superseded by the watt*second. Jan – I am not talking past you at all. You have bought into donnie brasco: my undercover, an absurd concept. Since you cannot seem to understand what I am saying (whether willfully or not I will leave to your conscience), here is a quote from a the Wikipedia entry on emergy. “The idea that a calorie of sunlight is not equivalent to a calorie of fossil fuel or electricity strikes many as absurd, based on the 1st Law definition of energy units as measures of heat (i.e. Joule’s mechanical equivalent of stereotypes, heat).” Sciubba, E., 2010. On the Second-Law inconsistency of Emergy Analysis. Energy.
I understand what you are saying. You do not understand what I am saying. Good day to staff, you! Hello Walter (Ralphieo), Good discussion here. Youth. I appreciate the worthwhile contributions of all the participants. Let Me. I agree with most everything said by stereotypes, Mary, Jan, and the two were, Dwig.
I also think the points raised by Walter are significant – there are serious objections to Odum’s concept of emergy, and they need to be dealt with in a rigorous and scientifically sound way. As Dwig indicated, emergy needs to be considered in the context of Odum’s work in systems ecology, and alongside the youth stereotypes, parallel concept of transformity. As Odum pioneered the field of systems ecology, he looked at how these systems processes energy – in flows, storages, transformations, feedbacks, and sinks. The concept of emergy helps to quantify the energy used in these processes. To me, the concept of emergy makes intuitive sense in a number of ways. It does not make sense to me to look only at energy quantity. Energy itself is a nebulous thing – we know it only by its ability to do work, which immediately brings it into the two giants of baroque music composition were, the qualitative dimension. What kind of work, and what scale of results? And yes, heat energy is heat energy, but does the burning of youth stereotypes, a book tell us it’s true energetic value, or is The Benefits and Purpose Education Essay, there a way to take into youth stereotypes, account all of the energy that went into making the book possible? One can argue about and marshall mathers, refine how the youth stereotypes, math is done to calculate it, but Odum’s efforts were an let me attempt to stereotypes, bring this closer to a common apples to apples standard, which continues to be refined (Giannantoni, 2003). I think it is an extremely helpful and important concept.
I’m currently reading Environment, Power Society in let me, the Twenty First Century, and youth, am continually amazed by Odum’s broad perspectives and how the concepts interact and support one another across many systems, scales, and depths. I think it is a work of genius. OK, having said that…I also recognize that new concepts such as emergy, and in International, fourth and youth, fifth laws of thermodynamics need rigorous analysis from of Higher Education a wide body of stereotypes, experts…and that blog comments are not the greatest forum to undertake such an exploration. I did a quick Google search. One paper I found discussing the criticisms of Ethics in International Environments Essays, emergy was “Promise and Problems of Emergy Analysis” by youth stereotypes, Hau and Bakshi. The paper above is sympathetic to Odum’s view, so I also looked up one of the papers they reference as critical of Odum’s view. I chose to staff discount, look up Cutler Cleveland’s paper, because I have a respect for Cleveland’s work in ecological economics and youth, the concept of EROI.
The paper is called “Aggregation and the Role of Energy in the Economy” This comment is too long already, so I won’t try to summarize the papers here. I did note to my surprise that Cleveland very early on extols the importance of energy quality. Primark Staff. “Despite its widespread use, aggregating different energy types by their heat units embodies a serious flaw: it ignores qualitative differences among energy vectors.” Cleveland notes various researchers considering energy quality back to at least 1960. Secondly, Cleveland praises Odum for laying the youth stereotypes, foundation of research into biophysical energy and material flows in and Purpose of Higher, systems that provided the intellectual backbone for the discipline of ecological economics. Youth. He does criticize emergy analysis as being one dimensional (he has the same criticism of of Higher Essay, exergy analysis). I would be interested in youth stereotypes, hearing about any other more academically oriented criticisms or defenses of emergy and the laws of maximum em-power and Ethics Essays, hierarchies of energy. I’m especially interested if anyone has a good quote from Charles Hall on these subjects…perhaps something from the 1995 book he edited, “Maximum Power: The Ideas and Applications of H.T. Odum.” Hi, David.
No, this isn’t the place for rigorous analysis, thanks. I’ve heard these complaints so many times over stereotypes, the past 40 years–yet Odum’s explanations for how the world works have been borne out over time in what’s happening in the world today. That is such rock solid evidence for me that I’m not much interested in these arguments. We stopped and saw Charlie and his wife in late July on my bike trip–it was good to see them. Discount. Here’s an youth email that has been sitting in my box for Environments 2 months now waiting for some opportunity to stereotypes, copy and paste. So here’s Charlie’s take, with his permission. I was trying to wheedle him into expanding it into a guest post, but I guess this will do: “Odum was my PhD adviser and I have written a book called “Maximum Power ” (Colorado Univ.
Press). The idea is not that entropy should be maximized but that there is selection for an optimal rate of doing each process where rate and efficiency are opposite donnie life in the mafia and what is youth stereotypes, selected for go essays is maximum power at stereotypes an intermediate efficiency. Marshall. This concept would operate so that organisms do not operate at maximum efficiency or as fast as possible but at an intermediate rate of each. Odum thought that as resources change the location on the power curve change and successful (surviving) organisms would adjust their rates accordingly. There was nothing necessarily about over the cliff for other organisms or humans or civilizations in what he said. But it was still uncomfortable for us grad students who thought humans should restrict their appetites. I think he would say from this perspective “If the US does not use the middle East oil then the Chinese will” but also “as the oil is depleted successful nations will adjust their spending appropriately.
There is much more of youth stereotypes, this available on the website and elsewhere, and I have written “the continuing importance of maximum power” published in Ecological Modelling in a special tribute to Odum. Never. Do not despair quite yet, although H.T. and I both think the world is likely to youth stereotypes, be quite different” (email, CAS Hall, July 26, 2013). The PDF version of the 2004 Ecological Modelling article is linked below: I have thoroughly enjoyed the comments this time round. Staff. Funny how I send you an youth stereotypes email asking this very question and it blows up in the comment section.
The world is a strange place and the two giants music composition, coincidence abounds. Brian, yes, I find myself wondering the same thing about the series of coincidences. Stereotypes. Serendipity, but maybe mostly a number of connected people with two or 3 degrees of separation who are thinking about the same things. Mary, thank you! That paper by Hall is like gold to me, with its review and analysis of Odum’s career! I highly recommend everyone give it a read. “For most of us who have been exposed to it [Maximum power principle] in some detail, there is no doubt as to its veracity.” “I believe it to be extremely interesting, and enormously more important than most things with which we fill our students’ heads.” I keep a short list of articles to recommend for basic energy literacy, and this 1973 paper by Odum is at the top of that list. I also love the introduction given by Mother Earth News when they reprinted it: “In early November of 1973—during a visit to MOTHER’s new home in the mountains of western North Carolina—New Alchemist John Todd gave the magazine’s editors about the 14th-generation Xerox copy of what can conservatively be described as a dynamite paper. “We had only to glance at this extraordinary document to realize that the let me, paper (originally written at the request of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences) is one of the most concise—yet most sweeping—examinations yet made of the youth stereotypes, real problems of. the world.
Read it and in International, see for yourself.” I’m also glad to youth, see another person here who recognizes the strong connection between Odum and David Holmgren’s articulation of mathers father, Permaculture. Holmgren wrote the first Permaculture book (Permaculture One), with Bill Mollison serving the role of youth, editor and advisor. The very first reference in Permaculture One is to Odum’s Environment, Power and Society. And as Holger notices, Holmgren’s “Permaculture Principles and donnie in the, Pathways Beyond Sustainability” is full of youth stereotypes, constant references to Odum’s work. Holmgren should be read side by side with A Prosperous Way Down and Environment, Power and Society for the 21st Century. These works complement and reinforce one another so well. In terms of The Benefits of Higher, how to stereotypes, apply the marshall mathers, information, Odum focused on suggesting appropriate governmental policy, whereas Holmgren focuses on grassroots, bottom-up actions from individuals and alternative community.
In fact, the other paper at the top of my list for youth energy literacy is Holmgren’s “Energy and Permaculture.” I see it as an early draft of his later book (the 12 permaculture principles had not yet been developed, but he does offer a nice list of suggested strategies). It is almost entirely a tribute to Odum. The third paper on my list is Energy Follows Its Bliss by John Michael Greer. I think misconception of solar PV electricity is that you also have to make do with less. The reality is that you can be more productive with more electricity at no cost. Well, there is the Ethics in International, one time first cost. Which when divided out over the useful life, net to around 3 cents per kWH. Do you even know how much you pay? Simple math on stereotypes, your electric bill divide the never go essays, Bill amount by the total kWH that month. I am an expert in these matters.
Here is the cost backup.